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Your Thoughts: "The Muppets" Theatrical Film

Discussion in 'Muppet Headlines' started by Phillip, Nov 22, 2011.

  1. ZeppoAndFriends

    ZeppoAndFriends Well-Known Member

    I'm with the camp of fans that thinks Fozzie actually broke the sign (with an addendum that, since the deadline was midnight and Tex was most certainly not going to give them ANY wiggle room, it really didn't matter that he did).

    If you think about it, the people answering the phones keep written records of the amounts donated, so it seems unlikely that the big, light-up sign could've been so off the mark in the first place. :skeptical:
  2. Oscarfan

    Oscarfan Well-Known Member

    The power did go out during the telethon. They could've been getting the amount of money shown on the board, but then the power outage screwed it up somehow.

    I think the meaning of it is Fozzie hits the board, showing its true value. The $25 thing doesn't bother me; it never occurred to be when watching it. I don't see why it would be a miserable a failure if he broke the sign and showed a number they didn't have. It is more devastating to them if it's the other way around.
  3. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member

    Seems you confused a group of people who can't really do anything with a version of Robin Hood who doesn't have his priorities straight. Just sayin'...
  4. Pinkflower7783

    Pinkflower7783 Well-Known Member

    Did I mention it's only a movie people? I'm just saying as well.
  5. jvcarroll

    jvcarroll Well-Known Member

    I'm neither a fan of Wall Street nor the Occupy movement and I'm not sure why this thread has been derailed by them. There are always those rowdy members of nearly every social movement, but is there some current crime spree of actual muggers who identify themselves as part of the Occupy movement? I don't have cable therefore I don't have to suffer the sort of tabloid journalism that is cable news. You know the kind of "news" where they exaggerate or create a problem, hire guest stars, compose theme music and force people to choose sides on something that either doesn't really exist or is far more nuanced than it has been portrayed.

    On another topic, I've been a big supporter of Jason Segel's vision from the start, but he's recently expressed that part of "growing up" involves putting away all of his Muppet memorabilia and severing all ties with future Muppet productions. He made himself the posterboy of life-long fandom as a productive adult so this recent turn saddens me. I don't dismiss him for making a personal choice. It's just that most of us fans felt that he was the guy that "got it" and now that appears not to be the case. To be honest, it does diminish his scenes in the film for me just a little bit, but nothing can derail the overwhelming dose of healthy nostalgia the film presents as a whole. The fact that he was instrumental in creating that is what I will cling to and I thank him for that very much. I am convinced that this movie (and no other) was the one needed to usher in a new era of Muppets. They can now go anywhere from here.

    Segel also revealed three official Muppet rules on national television.
    1. The Muppets do not think of themselves as puppets.
    2. The Muppets know they are stronger together than they are apart.
    3. The Muppets never lie to each other. (Diversion is more their game)
    newsmanfan likes this.
  6. Pinkflower7783

    Pinkflower7783 Well-Known Member

    With all due respect to Jason and I just wanna say without his love for the muppets and his passion and drive to get the movie made lets face it the muppets would be right back where they were before the movie came out doing well...not much. I mean he really is what got the muppets back to where they should be. However I don't mean to sound heartless but I feel like he does he did what he wanted to do. He said he doesn't want it to seem like he's trying to capitalize on the muppets all he wanted to do was bring them to how he remembered them. And has also said their gonna do just fine without him and I agree they don't need him. They needed him to give them the boost they needed and that's it.

    I personally don't care what Jason does with his muppet collection. I mean I went to see the muppets not Jason. Just my opinion.
  7. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member

    Poorly executed joke that wasn't funny because of skewed facts. Person who posted it is in the camp that believes that wanting corporations to pay their fair share of taxes and not being on the very same welfare state they complain the poor are abusing is somehow considered "stealing." I'm not saying any more to that.

    This is the real story and the basis of the thread.

    We probably would have got another Muppet movie in time under Disney. Problem is, those who have been on the inside feel that the Muppets need some sort of gimmick to make a new project stand out.

    That's why we had Muppets From Space and Muppets In Space (the one that wasn't made). They wanted a movie with Muppets and Sci-Fi because the movie was due out in 1999, and that was the summer Star Wars episode 1 came out, and every movie had to have some reference to Star Wars (or Smashmouth's All Star).

    Look at the first three Muppet Movies. Other than the fact GMC is a period piece and an homage to musicals and crime caper films, all three of the first movies had the Muppets in an organic story where they play themselves, even though they hit the reboot button every time. Then look at the films we had since, but before tyhe new one...

    Muppet Christmas Carol, Treasure Island and Wizard of Oz... classic retellings. Gimmick.

    Muppets FROM Space.... sci-fi story (already covered this)... Gimmick

    Very Merry Muppet Christmas Movie, Letters to Santa... holiday special... Gimmick.

    Kermit's Swamp Years.... prequel... not as gimmicky as the others, but still Gimmick.

    Even the films that didn't get made... Time Travel, Super Heroes, Camelot... everything but Brain Lynch's Muppet Movie Sequel... all Gimmicks.

    The Muppets should be strong enough to hold a movie down with the least amount of gimmickry possible. But when you're inside too long, it's not so much slowly becoming blind to what made the characters special... they always knew. It's slowly starting to think that you need a gimmick to get people to start watching them again.

    We would have seen some sort of meh classic retelling or some theme movie of some sort if they made it themselves, and it wouldn't have the same passion from the fanbase or the common theater goer that forgot they liked the Muppets. Even the flier for the Cambridge MA Brattle Theater showing of the new Muppet Film weekend before last called the movies before The Muppets subpar sequels.

    It took the outside vision of Jason, Nick and James, and the franchise know how of the veterans to make a great movie that brought them back to where they should be, movie wise.
  8. jvcarroll

    jvcarroll Well-Known Member

    Perfectly stated. Segel, like us, saw the untapped value of the franchise instead of the corporate cynicism that tainted Muppets From Space or the presumption from other insiders that the Muppets could just pick up where they left off and the public would automatically accept them. He knew that the Muppets required another introduction so that new fans could be created and keep the franchise alive. Of course all of this was done while maintaining the roots of the Muppets.

    A lot of us longtime forum members have witnessed many steps and missteps as they were happening over the years. We know there is no lone savior of the Muppets. It's not that simple. Many things came into alignment and Segel was one of the very strong pillars in the Muppets' relaunch.


    In the end, you're right. It doesn't really matter. The film was wonderful and it did the trick. It's probably a good idea for him to move on professionally. I just find it strange that Segel's rabid fandom, an integral part of the "Muppets" film promotion, has fizzled so quickly. He's been actively making a point to personally distance himself from the Muppets in ways we don't really need to know as kind of an over-share. It could be due to the adult-themed film he's promoting that hasn't been doing very well. Heck, if Segel wants to get rid of some Muppet stuff...I'll take it!!! :fanatic:
  9. zoebell

    zoebell Active Member

    well, i think it's because he didn't want people to get the impression that he wanted to take over and become like the new jim henson, forever associated with the muppets

    to which i say, that's probably going to happen anyway, that people are going to associate him with relaunching them into a new era and that won't be forgotten, because he had so much to do with it. and also because when they were promoting the movie, he really was the face of it in many ways, and he openly and enthusiastically exposed his passionate muppet love to the world. and then of course, the movie was a hit, got stellar reviews and won an actual oscar to boot. it'd be one thing if it had failed and gone away, but huge successes are well documented, and he was very much associated with that

    esp by the media. muppet fans themselves are all about the muppets, and most of them didn't mind at all that he wasn't coming back, and probably didn't even expect it. but the media had basically sealed jason segel to the muppets success, so if he wanted to do just the one movie and then move on, he probably has to make that as clear as possible very early
  10. Pinkflower7783

    Pinkflower7783 Well-Known Member

    I just hope I made it clear I am in no way knocking Jason at all...I don't know that he wants to totally distance himself and act like he never made the movie but like he said that movie took up a decade of his life. Bascially in my opinon Jason just wanted to help the muppets and he did just that plain and simple. And I agree with Zoebell I don't think he wants people thinking he's trying to become the next Jim Henson. I doubt right after the movie he took his muppet stuff out to the dumpster and trashed it Lol! Like he said he's just ready to do more adult type movies. Also it could be right now he just wants to concentrate on his recent movie that came out Five Year Engagement.

    Nick did say he would like to show Jason the finished script for the next movie when it's done to just maybe get his input.

    I'd also like to add I don't need to be a member of this forum to know that the muppets until this movie were pretty much at a standstill. Like the movie I basically forgot them for 12 years. And I've said it before The Muppets went through the exact same thing that Disney did when Walt died. They both went through dark periods where again nobody knew what the heck to do with them without their leaders. Until some years later when finally someone or many people just got it.
  11. jvcarroll

    jvcarroll Well-Known Member

    That's true for a lot of the public and I kinda get your point, but here are just a few high-profile highlights that forum members have been talking about since Muppets From Space and before last year's film. While the Muppets hadn't maintained a wave of popularity as they did in the 70's and 80's, they really weren't stagnant either. There have been plenty of active projects and products on the market. Not many franchises get a fraction of this kind of love...

    2000:
    • Muppet V-chip Ads
    2001:
    • Muppet Fest
    • Best of the Muppet Show, Muppet Movie, DVDs
    2002:
    • It's a Very Merry Muppet Christmas Movie
    • Kermit's Swamp Years DVD
    • Music, Mayhem and More! CD
    • Muppets dominate Macy's windows
    • Palisades Muppets action figures
    • Sideshow Muppet busts
    • UPS, Denny's & Long John Silvers commercials
    2003:
    • MasterCard commercials
    • Rocky Mountain Holiday comes to DVD
    2004:
    • Muppets.com relaunches
    • Best of the Muppets CD
    • Pizza Hut Commercials
    2005:
    • The Muppets' Wizard of Oz
    • Muppet Postage Stamps
    • Muppets dominate Macy's windows again
    • Muppet Show Season One comes to DVD
    • Target, NBA & Dove Commercials
    2006:
    • Kermit's Ford Commercial Campaign
    • Statler and Waldorf: From the Balcony at Movies.com
    • Kermit's Book: Before You Leap
    • A Green & Red Christmas CD (Grammy Winner)
    • Master Replicas Kermit poser is released
    • Muppet TV airs in France
    2007:
    • Muppet Show Season Two comes to DVD
    • Disney Store begins to trickle Muppet merchandise
    2008:
    • A Muppet Christmas: Letters to Santa
    • Studio DC Almost Live
    • Muppets on Disney XD Launches
    • Pepe's Book: It's Hard Out Here for a Shrimp
    • Muppet Show Season Three comes to DVD
    • Master Replicas' Animal & Gonzo posers are released
    2009:
    • Bohemian Rhapsody & Viral Muppets
    • Muppets Comics from Boom!
    • Muppets Give A Day Campaign
    • Piggy's Book: The Diva Code
    2010:
    • The Muppets Kitchen with Cat Cora
    • More Viral Muppet Content
  12. Pinkflower7783

    Pinkflower7783 Well-Known Member

    Okay but it makes it sound like unless you've been a member of this forum for 10 years or more then people wouldn't truly understand the muppets and I strongly disagree with that. But I don't wanna derail this conversation anymore so moving on.

    And I feel you also need to look outside the muppet forum because while maybe everyone on HERE hasn't forgotten the muppets many people did outside. And to me none of the things they did after Jim were good. I hope I don't get flammed for that. But I'm just gonna be blunt and say for me none of what they did during that time was good. I'm not saying all of it was so terrible I hated it but it was like after Jim died that spark was just gone. And I think many people felt that for years. Again just my personal opinion.
    heralde likes this.
  13. heralde

    heralde Well-Known Member

    Sadly the problem was quantity vs quality. That's why I'm glad Segel did finally get it back on track. :)
    Pinkflower7783 likes this.
  14. Pinkflower7783

    Pinkflower7783 Well-Known Member

    Thank you!!! That's exactly it! I'd like this 20 times if I could. LOL!
    heralde likes this.
  15. heralde

    heralde Well-Known Member

    Lol, solidarity! :halo: :halo:
  16. zoebell

    zoebell Active Member

    i would agree EXCEPT for the muppet christmas carol. one of my favorite movies ever, lol
    Nasubionna likes this.
  17. heralde

    heralde Well-Known Member

    Oh yeah I like it as a Christmas movie. I just don't see it as a Muppety movie.
  18. Pinkflower7783

    Pinkflower7783 Well-Known Member

    I have tried so many times to like that movie but I can't...:/
    heralde likes this.
  19. Ruahnna

    Ruahnna Well-Known Member

    On the whole Jason distancing himself thing....

    First of all, bless him. Fifty times thank you, Jason! But here's something that changed for Jason once he actually made the movie, and it was something that we saw happen to Walter in the movie. At first, there is star-gazing--wanting desperately to be a part of something that you see (it doesn't have to be on television) and feeling that, somehow, you have something to contribute to them. Fandom of all kinds is rife with people who feel that way. But once Walter became one of the muppets in the movie, then some of his hero-worship of Kermit and the others naturally went away and they became...friends. Jason was a fan, and now he's a friend. It changes the basic nature of the relationship.

    I had the very rare privilege once of making friends with one of my heroes. I had written a fan story and he responded to it. We began to exchange letters and, at different conventions, introduced our spouses, went to dinner, etc. Once, my husband and I took his lovely wife out--away from the convention--for a breather while he did his thing on stage. I will admit just a twinge of guilt/envy because I missed his session on stage at the convention, but I felt like it was more important to be a friend instead of a fan at that time. He and his wife were kind enough to indulge my "OMGosh! I'm so excited!"-ness when it occasionally surfaced, which it did more and more rarely. Once, in order to escape the press of fans, they spent part of the afternoon in my hotel room. I seem to remember sewing on my costume for the costume contest while we talked, outwardly nonchalant but just thrilled inside to be with them, a trusted and familiar friend.

    Another friend of mine not only met one of her screen heroes (on a fan cruise), but she MARRIED him. A few years later, she donated all of the fan paraphernalia she had collected about him to a charity auction. It wasn't that she wasn't still a fan of his--she most certainly was!--but it was now a real relationship and she had moved from adoring him from afar to adoring him up-close-and-personal. He seemed to appreciate the latter more than the former!

    Luckily for us, Jason got to meet some of his heroes and, in the process, made those same heroes accessible to others in a way they hadn't been before. When you've been "rubbing Elmos" with the muppets for the better part of a year, then the heat of fan worship ought to cool a little, and be replaced by the warm fuzziness of friendship.

    Also, and this saddens me to think, but Hollywood is anxious to pigeon-hole actors so they can better package them--like giving a laundry soap a catchy slogan. Jason has and will have his own significant body of work, and giving away his muppet fan stuff may have been necessary to keep Hollywood from constantly aligning him with a project to which he has already given what he hoped to give. To keep from being known as "that muppet man," he may have had to take more drastic measure. If that is the case, I sincerely hope that he stuffed a secret treasure or two in the back of his closet to remember what brought him to the muppets, and what brought the muppets back to us. I will always be one of his fans because of that, wherever his career may take him.

    On a quick personal note--I would appreciate other forum members not presuming to speak for me or state my opinions without being asked. I am, as you can see, perfectly capable of making my own opinions known in the way that I wish.
    Aaron and Bannanasketch like this.
  20. charlietheowl

    charlietheowl Well-Known Member

    Good points here regarding Jason's decisions recently. His star is at about his peak, and it's best for him to try and do as many different things as possible to establish himself as an A-list actor/writer. Sadly The Five Year Engagement is not doing all that well at the box office despite getting decent reviews (I haven't seen, so I don't know if there's anything to it. He has to keep going forward, just like I'll imagine he'll leave How I Met Your Mother in a couple years to do movies full-time.

    Also, "rubbing Elmos" is one of the most brilliant turns of phrase I've seen on this forum ever. Many salutations and congratulations.


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