The Bible and Love and Christians

CensoredAlso

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 16, 2002
Messages
14,028
Reaction score
2,292
And remember, Morgan's whole schtick on 30 Rock is saying and doing insanely ignorant/buffoonish things much to the chagrin of his co-workers.
I think this is an example of how comedians and entertainers have to keep becoming more and more outrageous in order to stay relevant. Unfortunately that often means becoming more and more mean spirited (not to mention unfunny, heh).
 

frogboy4

Inactive Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2002
Messages
10,080
Reaction score
358
A friend of mine just relocated this little video on YouTube. I think we should be long past wondering if being gay is a choice, but it was brought up once again and this colorful propaganda cartoon beautifully states a lot of my thinking on the topic. This point of view is rather difficult to dispute unless facts are abandoned in favor of Biblical references or an unfounded personal bias against gay people. Personally, I hate approaching this topic because it's a no-win for those people who are gonna be "aginnit" no matter what. Still, I felt that this cute cartoon was worth posting.


(Keep in mind that this information is probably PG rated​
It may not be suitable for everyone's palette.)​
 

beaker

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2002
Messages
7,761
Reaction score
858
A friend of mine just relocated this little video on YouTube. I think we should be long past wondering if being gay is a choice, but it was brought up once again and this colorful propaganda cartoon beautifully states a lot of my thinking on the topic. This point of view is rather difficult to dispute unless facts are abandoned in favor of Biblical references or an unfounded personal bias against gay people. Personally, I hate approaching this topic because it's a no-win for those people who are gonna be "aginnit" no matter what. Still, I felt that this cute cartoon was worth posting.


(Keep in mind that this information is probably PG rated​
It may not be suitable for everyone's palette.)​
Well, I mean there's people that believe the earth is young...dinosaurs are a "test", the earth is flat, etc. I think people should be allowed to believe what they want, as long as they dont use those beliefs to circumvent the rights of others. Yet, why is it so many of the most virulently anti gay Republicans in Washington DC who have a tract record of anti gay laws...end up being outed themselves as closeted gay men? It's interesting.

About the choice thing...I've met countless 40-50 year old lesbians who were married, had kids but seemed to become a "sister" much later in life. So there may be some aspects that arent entirely genetic, or perhaps it was a dormant trait. That animated video you posted and the Pixar short on gay bullying are amazing videos, especially the Pixar thing

I may not like the government, but I am happy Obama has tried to may LGBT awareness and has spoken out on bullying. AND...as much as I hate this current twilight beiber glee pop mainstream youth culture; fact is most youth these days almost seem to scoff at the notion of homophobia as if it were some archaic alien ideology.
 

beaker

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2002
Messages
7,761
Reaction score
858
Dr Tooth: I know you dont want to ruffle feathers, and stick to the "both sides are being idiots" thing in the Israeli/Palestinian conflict...but you should see this video made recently by two young Palestinian teens that was posted on a mainstream British news site. Basically, it highlights the unjust evictions and cruelty many Palestinians go through. How so many have their land and homes taken and given to Jewish tourists and illegal Israeli settlers. It's not fair, and you'd think people who routinely use the holocaust as a blind shield to justify all action would be more sensitive to how they themselves have oppressed a racial/religious group: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2011/jun/08/israel-palestinian-territories-twins-english

If it was Jews being oppressed by Arabs, I'd be speaking on that too. Just like I speak out on China or Iraq abusing Christians. I think a lot of Israelis are brought up in this thinking of entitlement, when each and every Israeli citizen should be demanding better treatment and rights for Palestinians.
 

Drtooth

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2002
Messages
31,718
Reaction score
6,707
Sadly, it's a very very common thing to hear black male celebrities(be they actors, athletes or musicians) viciously attack gays and the gay community. I think it's more to do with the notion that gay=less than a full man; and unfortunately some aspects of black male culture(just like white, hispanic and arab male culture) revolves around being a tough guy. Many black people seem to get upset for even mentioning the civil rights struggle and the gay rights issue in the same breath...but it may ultimately come down to an issue of class. Many gay males are seen as upper class white men of privilege, so that may be a factor. Unfortunately too, statistics show gay black males are more likely to contract AIDS in the modern era.
The scary thing is, I really wanted to say that, but was afraid I'd sounded racist. I hate that culture of being a REAL man and driving railroad spikes in with your fists. That sort of thing ALSO leads to gang violence, and a lot of gang members only join up because that's their model of manhood. Aren't a lot of rap musicians homophobic? I bet they're the same ones that say it's manly to smack up a ho.

There is NOTHING more homophobic than instilling false senses of manhood into someone and upholding centuries old cavemen stereotypes. That crap is a relic and only funny to laugh at. But hey, people who are homophobic are very much not confident in their sexuality. You are not REALLY a tough guy if that sort of thing bothers you.

However, athletes like Charles Barkley have spoken out against this sort of thing. And remember, Morgan's whole schtick on 30 Rock is saying and doing insanely ignorant/buffoonish things much to the chagrin of his co-workers. Sadly, like Charlie Sheen's portrayal in 2.5 Men...the real life and fictional characters seem blurred.
Heh... you ever see Jane whatshername outside of 30 Rock? Exactly the same as her character too. But then again, the show was written and created by someone who worked with them in the past. The only main character who's the polar opposite of themselves in real life is Democrat Alec Baldwin's portrayal of a Reagan loving neo-con. There's so much of that show that's inside humor, YET there's a lot of it that seeps into their actual actors.... seriously, the way Jane screwed up that broadcast of the tree lighting ceremony that year...

But anyway, again there are things I must say about this.

Let me add this:
As many of you know, early last month Chuck Norris began to be in the news very briefly (and quickly overshadowed by events in Japan, of course) after speaking out against U.S. public schools for "defending homosexuality" (a position consistent with his 2008 stance against marriage equality for same-sex couples). It's safe to say, we think, that a number of his fans prefer to just remember him as the martial arts hero he'd been known as in the '70s, '80s and '90s, on film and on TV.
Now... how come we're clearly going to vilify and destroy the career of someone who said some unfunny hateful crap as a joke and ignore someone who's actually out to do do harm? That's completely and utterly a double standard? A comedian says stupid things, they get completely and utterly in trouble and lose work. Someone who's been supporting the most regressive of all rightwing candidates, however, goes around basically saying "Bullying is okay because it makes gay people kill themselves which is an act of God," and we turn a blind eye saying "Oh that wacky right wing regressive guy!" Bull! Either they're BOTH bad and deserve to have their careers destroyed or they're both stupid people who say stupid things and get a pay check.

Secondly, I'd LOVE to see some passive aggressive retaliation by the writers of 30 Rock. Not so much writing Tracy off the show, but just mocking his homophobia in a nasty way. There seems like a great plotline there. Look at Curb your Enthusiasm when they had the Seinfeld reunion. They made very big references to Michael Richards's blowup.

Thirdly... isn't the "Lesbians are just angry at men." an old hack shock comic standby? That seems like some crap Andrew Dice Clay would've said.

AND...as much as I hate this current twilight beiber glee pop mainstream youth culture; fact is most youth these days almost seem to scoff at the notion of homophobia as if it were some archaic alien ideology.
I'm not a fan of Glee and all, but I like the message of the show (and Kathy Griffin's portrayal of Tea Party activist politicians that slid by their butts because they won beauty pageants). It seems that, and this is what I've been saying with the Middle East, the only way to kill hatred is for the younger generation to realize how counterproductive, pointless, and stupid it is. No wonder certain religious groups are trying to control the media and make them look like brainwashing villains. They want to do the brainwashing to keep years of pointless, counterproductive hate alive.
 

CensoredAlso

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 16, 2002
Messages
14,028
Reaction score
2,292
No wonder certain religious groups are trying to control the media and make them look like brainwashing villains. They want to do the brainwashing to keep years of pointless, counterproductive hate alive.
Every group, whether it's religion, the media, your parents, school, or your peer group, is guilty of "brainwashing." And it's quite amusing how they all insist that they're the honest ones, lol.

Yet, why is it so many of the most virulently anti gay Republicans in Washington DC who have a tract record of anti gay laws...end up being outed themselves as closeted gay men? It's interesting.
It's really not that complicated actually. These men can't face their own emotions so they react by taking out their frustrations and fears on others.

In the comic strip Doonesbury, the character Mark was revealed to be gay a few years ago. But originally he was shown speaking very hostilely about homosexuality on his radio show, until someone suggested he just couldn't admit his own feelings. And Mark is the liberal activist in the strip! So really anyone can be guilty of this.
 

frogboy4

Inactive Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2002
Messages
10,080
Reaction score
358
The extreme dangers of believing that gay is a choice!
:search:
I could pretend to understand that plight of women, blacks or oppressed people in foreign countries but the fact is I don't have a clue! It's simple to sit back and pontificate my opinions about something that really isn't part of me. Many straights and Christians have their differing beliefs concerning the legitimacy of being gay and it's everyone's right to believe how they wish. That doesn't mean that their speculative point of view isn't toxic in the lives of others. :grouchy:

The fact is that many of these "Ex-Gay" groups are led by proven hypocrites who do not practice what they preach. They fleece others of their money, dignity and sense of self until the day they're caught with a same-sex partner usually in the most seedy of circumstances as cowards often do. :boo: And messing with a kid the way these folk did has to be some of the worst kind of evil there is!!​

(part 1 of 3, the others are available on YouTube under CNN's "the sissy boy experiment")​

The only real way that Anti-Gay Supremacists can gain ground to enforce their social beliefs on the lives of others without sounding like primeval bigots is to rob gays of their legitimacy. It hurts real people and destroys real lives in a way that living out, open and proud doesn't. Don't get me wrong, it ain't easy. But denial is poison that eats away at a person until there's nothing left. That's the point that sleazy snake-oil salesmen, like those featured in this video, approach these broken people and mess with their lives even more much like how the KKK recruits disenfranchised kids from abusive homes.​

It's Pride month and it's 20 years since I came out of the closet as a 17 year old Houstonian. I was part of a generation between the extremely oppressed of decades past and the current one with a greater sense of entitlement.​

Of course many people from all over will descend upon the city and there will be celebrations of all sorts. Some will be life-affirming and others will be risque. I'm certain the Pat Robertsons and Fox Newsies will yet again focus on the Gay "Martis Gras" elements and ignore the rest. It's also funny that they use incorrect footage, street names and other such bad information. I live here and find that particularly irritating. Would it be fair for me to paint all straight people because of the real Martis Gras? Of course not. I do have my own opinions about what's appropriate.​

I wave my friendly freak flag 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 365 days of the year for 20 whole years. I don't need to cut loose, but others do and I embrace all elements of my community in San Francisco. Even the ones that make me feel uncomfortable.​

Peoples is peoples. Bears, Pigs, Frogs, Christians, Hindus, Gays, Blacks, Women...:cool:
 

Drtooth

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2002
Messages
31,718
Reaction score
6,707
The fact is that many of these "Ex-Gay" groups are led by proven hypocrites who do not practice what they preach. They fleece others of their money, dignity and sense of self until the day they're caught with a same-sex partner usually in the most seedy of circumstances as cowards often do. :boo: And messing with a kid the way these folk did has to be some of the worst kind of evil there is!!​
That sort of thing is why people hate Christians and why religion gets a bad name (that and the people constantly killing each other over land they think they own using religion as a tool to sucker people into taking sides)... I've said it a million times by now, but if people DON'T want to be lumped into the evil bigoted dark side of a religion, WHY don't they speak up louder and more vocal than the crazies with something to gain? People don't like stereotypes NOR do they like to be stereotyped. So why do they desperately cling on to them, or refuse to denounce them?

I remember reading that Graham Chapman of Monty Python had nothing but disdain for the flouncy, cartoonish gay stereotype as a gay person himself. I remember reading some examples he really hated, but I can't find out where I put that book to quote any of it (Monty Python Speaks, if anyone's looking for it). Yet, that JarJar Binks type stereotype is the same one anti-gay loud mouths always use to annoy and disgust people, yet keeping them distant enough to become personable and easy to relate to.

Really... this is an overly PC country. I've seen stuff from other countries that wouldn't fly in the 1950's over here yet are made recently (New Adventures of Lucky Luke episode Liki Liki... made in 2000 no less, even the Canadian English dub was shockingly offensive)... I still can't understand why people are so ticked about Mr. Popo on Dragon Ball Kai's ONE broadcast English dub is blue, considering... I mean, really... I've seen the Asian Anti-defamation league go berserk over the use of accents that aren't stereotypes (apparently some of the group have an issue with the Kung Fu genre too)... but people are still incredibly insensitive towards gays. Didn't certain religious groups use examples of religion to promote intolerance towards other races at one point too? I swear a certain not beloved American faction of Christianity was founded so they can spread the love of Jesus while beating and raping slaves up :rolleyes:
 
Top