President Obama!

[CensoredAlso]

No politician will ever be perfect.

I know, I know, hehe. Still, haven't found many that make me comfortable.

 

[MuppetQuilter]

The previous post was my moderator post. This is my personal opinion post.

I'm extremely disappointed that Prop 8 is passing. This is more significant than the other two state constitutional amendments that banned gay marriage last night because this reverses California state policy on marriage. There are many, many happily married gay couples living in California who now don't know if their marriages are still legal. Couples have been placed in a bizarre limbo-- which has to be a bad deja vu for some couples in San Francisco. To me, this is just cruel.

As for the funding from the Mormon church, it did not come directly from the Church. It came from individual church members and thus gets around the tax exempt status of a church and the limits that puts on political activities.

I'm bothered that the vast majority of the funding for Yes on 8 came from outside the state of California. I'm not sure it is right for the citizens of Utah to have that much say in what happens in California. At the same time, I'm in no position to talk as I donated to No on 8 and I don't live in California either. But, on a philosophical level, I question whether state issues should take funding from out of state.

I agree with Jamie-- this is a national issue. I believe it will be settled the same way interracial marriage was settled. The federal supreme court will, eventually, make gay marriage legal because it is discriminatory. Freedom of religion, one of the most basic and scared rights in this country, cannot exist without freedom from religion. The only arguments against gay marriage are based in religion (as were the arguments against interracial marriage). Many Americans were not ready to accept interracial marriage when the supreme court ruled (and the story of the couple that triggered that ruling-- Virginians-- is a compelling and heart breaking story-- look it up, the Washington Post ran it earlier this year). But fair is fair (as any five year old can tell you) and in Muppetdom we accept you as you are-- frog, pig, explosives maniac, or whatever.

 

[CensoredAlso]

Couples have been placed in a bizarre limbo-- which has to be a bad deja vu for some couples in San Francisco. To me, this is just cruel.

Yeah I mean, however you feel about it, that's not fair. Especially if there are kids involved.

 

[dwayne1115]

I have a question. What am i going to do with all this Mud i bought for all the Mud slinging? (Jumps into pool full of Mud)

 

[CensoredAlso]

Um, throw money at it?

 

[frogboy4]

Okay folks, listen up: I have undeleted a pile of posts. I did this on my own. It is my opinion that we can have a mature and respectful discussion on current events. We will disagree. Many of us feel passionately about our views for very significant and personal reasons. I expect EVERYONE to remember that we all have a right to our individual opinions. Expressing those opinions is fine so long as it is done in a way that is respectful and does not attack or belittle those who disagree.

This thread does not belong to one side or one view. Many of us are excited about President-Elect Obama. Many of us are not. The same goes for Prop 8 and gay marriage. These are topical, world-altering events and if we are going to have OT discussions on MC we can't ignore something as significant as a presidential election, much less the election of the first African American president. So, continue the discussion just keep it civil.

Thank you.

Thanks back! I do get passionate about this issue, but I do self-edit quite a bit (as you probably know). The deletions just seemed so out of the bluish. I'll keep an extra eye on my words and the concerns of other deletion reports as well. I guess more seem to be coming. I'm still surprised at how civil even the edited portions have been compared to years past. Thanks again. You always do an especially good job of this stuff and hardly get thanks for it!

It important to keep in mind not every religous person feels the same way on the topic. The media just likes concentrating on certain groups who are vocal, as you say. Of course, I think people are allowed to have their own opinions.

I agree and did go back and edit to clear that up right after I posted. Christians have many different beliefs when it comes to the war, social and civil issues. I pass by the anti-war Catholics all the time near the Civic Center area. They area actually a nicer type of protester than the usual ones we get.

There were quite a few religious leaders that unfairly condemned Obama. Some came out with YouTube ads judging him for not being a "real Christian" when only God knows his heart while others called him a sign of the apocalypse. Many of these figures are actually high-profile leaders respected in that community. It angers me how they use their faith to slander others in the most awful ways. I know for a fact they don't represent most of the Christians I know, but most of the atheists I know think these guys are the norm. I guess it's how the Fox News watchers view all gay people from the random excerpts of a Pride parade.

I just think we should all get the same chances in life. I'm not sure if I'll change my signature back for a while though. It's the most controversial one I've ever had. Well, there was the ambiguous quote from "future 44" that came from Obama, but I don't think anyone picked up on that. Nevertheless, things will change in time. Now I'm off to make my partner feel better about Prop 8. He really took it hard and cried a bit. I'm just mildly ticked-off.

I don't think Obama can do much, but he will at least protect the rights we do have so I feel good about that.

 

[anytimepally]

wow Snowthy, Nice Signiture!

indeed

 

[rtgentry]

...

 

[CensoredAlso]

I agree and did go back and edit to clear that up right after I posted. Christians have many different beliefs when it comes to the war, social and civil issues. I pass by the anti-war Catholics all the time near the Civic Center area. They area actually a nicer type of protester than the usual ones we get.

Well there is the Just War Theory the Jesuit priests created, many say the Iraq War did not fit the qualifications.

There were quite a few religious leaders that unfairly condemned Obama.

It is my opinion that religious organizations should stay out of politics, unless it's to protest a serious issue. Religions institutions should be above all this political stuff.

 

[rtgentry]

It is my opinion that religious organizations should stay out of politics, unless it's to protest a serious issue. Religions institutions should be above all this political stuff.[/QUOTE]

Abortion is not a seriouse Issue?