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Henson issues statement about Chick-Fila-A

seismicmike

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heralde, you are right on, but there's a difference between living in harmony with someone and participating in their sin with them. Jesus ate with the tax collectors and prostitutes, but he didn't go out and collect taxes with them or walk the street with them. When they expressed faith in him, he said "go and sin no more." He did not approve of their behavior or sanction it in any way, he simply reached out to them in love. It's a delicate balance that the church needs to walk as well.

Remember that I'm speaking from the perspective of someone whose conscience tells him that homosexuality is a sin and that participating in it would be sin for him. If the elders of a church do not believe it would be right before God for them to perform a gay marriage, I do not believe they should be forced to.

It's interesting to note that the apostle Paul actually spends some time in 1 Corinthians and Romans on a couple issues that are not sin issues, but he cautions believers to not cause each other to violate conscience. He writes specifically of meat sacrificed to idols. Some believed there was nothing wrong with eating it while others believed that it was tantamount to participating in idolatry. Even over an issue that was not a sin issue, Paul cautioned those who believed they could eat to be careful not to violate the conscience of those who believed they should not eat. This did not mean that they never ate, but that they did it in such a way as to not offend and to not cause the other to stumble.

In the same way, I hope that you can at least take that approach toward these churches. Even if you disagree with their opinion that homosexuality is a sin, at least understand that they believe it is and that requiring them to sanction it in certain ways would violate their conscience.

Does this make sense?
 

CensoredAlso

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heralde, you are right on, but there's a difference between living in harmony with someone and participating in their sin with them. Jesus ate with the tax collectors and prostitutes, but he didn't go out and collect taxes with them or walk the street with them. When they expressed faith in him, he said "go and sin no more." He did not approve of their behavior or sanction it in any way, he simply reached out to them in love. It's a delicate balance that the church needs to walk as well.
The problem is it's very clear why the tax collectors and prostitutes were wrong. Not so clear on homosexuality. My being attracted to men does not make me a good person. Why would the opposite make me a bad one?

If the elders of a church do not believe it would be right before God for them to perform a gay marriage, I do not believe they should be forced to.
The problem there is that the same argument was used to justify slavery. Slavery is mentioned in the Bible, therefore some Christians thought it should be continued.
 

seismicmike

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heralde, that is starting to get beyond the scope of my purpose here on this forum. It is not my intent to debate whether homosexuality is actually a sin or not. My goal is to simply show that Christians who believe that homosexuality is a sin are motivated primarily by conscience and not hatred. Slavery is an entirely different issue altogether. I could lay out what I believe to be clear reasoning for these, but I fear they would simply detract from the purpose of this forum and thread and distract from my original purpose of being here.

I'd be more than happy to share through some other medium, however. Thanks.
 

Drtooth

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I can't take Kirk Cameron seriously. He suggests the manner of a brainwashed cult member to me. Or maybe he's just an actor. Hehe, sorry. :wink:
I LOVE posting this article whenever Kirk's brought up.

Long story short, Kirk was an atheist that became a born again Christian while the show Growing Pains was on the air and completely acted like a dictator (or if you want, take off the word "tator") and forcibly took control of the show to put HIS extreme beliefs into the series.

Of course, Growing Pains absolutely sucks as a show. I do not want to offend Christians, but I DO want to offend Growing Pains fans. It's an AWFUL show. Just... really, REALLY bad.

heralde, that is starting to get beyond the scope of my purpose here on this forum. It is not my intent to debate whether homosexuality is actually a sin or not. My goal is to simply show that Christians who believe that homosexuality is a sin are motivated primarily by conscience and not hatred. Slavery is an entirely different issue altogether. I could lay out what I believe to be clear reasoning for these, but I fear they would simply detract from the purpose of this forum and thread and distract from my original purpose of being here.
My question was never answered. Why is it so bleeding important, though? I understand it isn't all hate, but what is the importance of a minor sin, not even listed on the common ground Ten Commandments that Jesus himself didn't talk about.

I understand a lot of religion is "whatever is written on the books is what we believe," But what of Christians that believe that it's all about the big picture, and the details are just that? I don't see how homosexuality being a sin makes anyone a better person, no matter what the intention is. Even if it is the best of intentions. How is that helping your fellow man?
 

CensoredAlso

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It is not my intent to debate whether homosexuality is actually a sin or not...My goal is to simply show that Christians who believe that homosexuality is a sin are motivated primarily by conscience and not hatred.
I totally understand. Sorry if it was uncomfortable. Just saying conscience is a very fragile concept and sometimes it's not enough to justify something.
 

Pinkflower7783

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I've always said "If you can't respect my opinions or my beliefs how do you expect me to respect yours?" I really hate when anyone regardless of religion tries to force their ideals and ways of thinking on someone else just because it's something they don't agree with. I always believe even if there is a difference of a opinon to learn from that person why they feel that way because maybe it'll help you gain a new perspective on it. I know sometimes I've learned something new about something I don't agree with. It might not change my mind but at least I have a new understanding.

And for Christians telling people their gonna go to ****...I don't know how people can say that to someone. It's just so beyond rude. And even if you do think that you should probably just keep your mouth shut. The only time you'll see me talking about my Christian faith is if you ask me and wanna know about it. Otherwise I'm not gonna sit there and force it on you.
 

CensoredAlso

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And for Christians telling people their gonna go to ****...I don't know how people can say that to someone. It's just so beyond rude.
Some people find that comforting in a twisted kind of way. The world is very unjust and unfair place, as we all know, and people like to think there's ultimately some kind of justice. Of course they don't think they're the ones facing it, hehe.
 

Oscarfan

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I understand a lot of religion is "whatever is written on the books is what we believe," But what of Christians that believe that it's all about the big picture, and the details are just that? I don't see how homosexuality being a sin makes anyone a better person, no matter what the intention is. Even if it is the best of intentions. How is that helping your fellow man?
A priest of some sort came into my religion class and answered such a question; he told us that homosexuality wasn't exactly a sin, but to have the fullest relationship with God, one should do it the compatible way he intended. I support gay marriage, but that was the first response I heard that was not just "It's in the Bible, so there!"
 

Pinkflower7783

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Some people find that comforting in a twisted kind of way. The world is very unjust and unfair place, as we all know, and people like to think there's ultimately some kind of justice. Of course they don't think they're the ones facing it, hehe.
If we wanna take the immature root we could always say "well so are you!" LOL!
 

CensoredAlso

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I don't see how homosexuality being a sin makes anyone a better person, no matter what the intention is. Even if it is the best of intentions. How is that helping your fellow man?
It is odd that it gained such prominence as a sin. It's really only mentioned a couple of times and not even by Jesus. I do think some of it is just that society is always a little uncomfortable with differences. And not because people are always bigoted; to a certain extent we are wired to be wary of differences. It's how we choose to react to that that matters.
 
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