Why did MFS and EIG bomb so bad?

[Traveling Matt]

The common denominator here is the Muppet franchise, not the owners. They're so far removed from their original popularity, unfortunately, that any sort of ascent to the top now is very difficult. Add to the fact that the media landscape is entirely different today, and you have one heck of an uphill climb in front of you.

I hope they find success again, but I feel the climb will be even more challenging than the last twenty years have been.

 

[D'Snowth]

The Henson kids care about the Muppets very much, but they don't want to work with them. They want to do their own thing.

Hmm... I'd hate to suggest this, but maybe they should take a hint from the Schulz family and simply retire the Muppets altogether?

I know I'm going to become very unpopular for that, but seriously, when Schulz passed away, the Peanuts gang went with him, because his children didn't want anyone else to try to continue the magic; unless the Henson children were to do something with the Muppets themselves, then perhaps maybe the Muppets should be laid to rest as well?

 

[Traveling Matt]

The kids couldn't make that call if they wanted to.

 

[D'Snowth]

I mean if they still owned them.

 

[frogboy4]

This is a renaissance? Heh...

One thing I am curious about... is there some special reason the Henson company doesn't want the Muppets? Ever since Jim's death (I'm well aware he was actually going to sell them to Disney shortly before his death anyway), they've sold them to Disney, to EMTV, and to Disney again, and it just gets me to wondering why. The empty promises are probably a major factor, but there has to be more to it than that if they keep selling them like this.

It's the beginning of one - comic books, television specials (placed less than a year apart), puppet products, posers, figures, an updated web pressence, a greater theme park presence and those are the things already here now. Have you not seen any of this or are discounting it all because there's no theatrical film and weekly television program? Those items are a lot harder to put together these days and the Henson Company seems to be much worse at it than Disney.

The Dark Crystal and the Fraggle films have had so many false fits and starts. Henson is not equipped to handle the Muppet property as in Jim's day. And toward the end he really did want to sell the Muippets because the marketing was such a burden. I suppose that's the same way the Henson Company felt when they sold to Disney.

Things aren't perfect, but the cup is far past half-full. Still, with the past of being burned by empty promises there are some fans that will take a pessimistic stance and I get that. Disney is reportedly setting the stage so bigger projects will make financial sense. There's a reason why they're the big dog...er mouse. It's because they know what works. They also seem intent on keeping the Muppet's persona intact. Pitching the Muppet Show took a long time for Jim. With such a long time removed from popular culture Disney has a lot of work to do...and they've been doing it. Their old plans were half-baked with no real goal insight. I see that they're still building. You're just focusing on the hole and not the delicious Muppet donut. Mmmm...donuts.

 

[D'Snowth]

Have you not seen any of this

No, I really haven't; when news of the comic books came out, I've been looking through comic stands all over town and have seen nothing. As far as merchandise is concerned, all I've seen were TWO Palisades sets... four years ago... in a comic book store.

But then, my town IS a hundred years behind everyone else, so...

 

[minor muppetz]

As for EIG, I'm agreeing with Frogboy... not to mention the fact that it was a brilliant idea on paper. I mean, Elmo-mania was sweeping the country and all... but his audience is mainly comprised of 23 year olds...

Really? 23 year olds? Who knew?

 

[frogboy4]

No, I really haven't; when news of the comic books came out, I've been looking through comic stands all over town and have seen nothing. As far as merchandise is concerned, all I've seen were TWO Palisades sets... four years ago... in a comic book store.

But then, my town IS a hundred years behind everyone else, so...

Oooh. Well, this one you might not like, but it does show the Disney love for the Muppets. They're making Munny-like urban vinyl sculpts, but with Mickey as a base design. They then throw on different skinned-paint-jobs. Kermit's was so popular that they are coming out with a few entire Muppet branded series. Here's the Kermit. It is a little sacrilegious, but I'm not a purist. I just like toys and this style is very popular these days. They also did the Muppet Star Wars PVCs. The Muppet Whatnot Workshop is also safe because no matter what happens to FAO they are going to create Whatnot stations inside the parks.

Disney seems to be proud of the Muppets now instead of treating them like an unwanted stepchild in a fairy tale. Right now the campaign is grass roots.

Pick up the comics if you can. The Muppet Show drawing is a bit stylized off-model, but it's mostly attractive and the writing is the most Muppety I've seen since the Jim-era. It's like no time has passed and they've been doing the show for years.

 

[D'Snowth]

Here's the Kermit.

Oh my head, lol.

 

[theprawncracker]

Just thought I'd pop in and say that I've read the whole thread and I'm quite impressed by the way this debate has gone. I have to say that I'm on the side that thinks MFS was a good film--but it is one that plays so much better on DVD than in theaters.

Also... I have to say that I completely respect your opinion Snowthy, but I'm of course siding with Jamie here. The signs are all out there that things can't go anywhere but up from here. Once buzz for the Halloween special starts to surface things will start to shine again.