Where is Steve Whitmire Petition

[beaker]

OK, so I know first hand that Disney are not commenting on this situation, nor is Artie Esposito.So now lets try and work this out.why wouldnt Disney want to comment?
What comes into my mind is that they are with holding because it will make them look bad.So I think we can rule out that steve is sick, and start thinking along the lines that Disney have terminated Steve's services.What we dont know is why.And lets hope they havent done the same with Dave Goelz.

Yeah it's not boding well for Disney to be so silent.

I doubt Goelz is going anywhere, I heard during the Muppet auditions a few years back hardly anyone was able to truly slip into Gonzo from a vocal or quirk standpoint.

In my view the Whitmire/Goelz dynamic and chemistry no matter what two characters they are doing(S&W? Gonzo and Kermit? Gonzo and Rizzo?) is absolutely amazing, second only to JH and Oz. So if Whitmire has been let go for whatever reason, or he decided to pursue other things long or short term...its definitely a huge disruption in the dynamic.

And, well there goes Rizzo.

 

[beaker]

As a puppeteer, I know that if a character I had been working with for 19 years was suddenly taken away from me, I would be devestated, and it upsets me to think that something like that could happen. It's appalling to think that this might have happened to Steve. I'm really hoping this isn't the case, but... it's hard not to think that at this point.

Well as much as hardcore Muppet fandom is a bit underground compared to most fandoms, itd be baddd news for Disney backlash wise to have pulled that sort of stunt.

I keep thinking we'll hear in a week or two that Whitmire was just taking a rest or had other commitments, but Disney contractually required "a" Kermit to fill some tv roles.

Does this seem the going feeling here?

Then again, NOTHING shocks me anymore.

This whole thing really upsets me, and if expletives were allowed on the MC boards, you can bet I'd be using all of them.

Would I still love the Muppets if Steve was fired? Absolutely. Would I watch the new things they had coming out? Absolutely not. No offense to Artie or to any one of you who has replied that they like and, in some cases, even prefer his Kermit, if that was the Kermit we were getting in Cheapest Muppet Movie, I wouldn't go see it.

Well it is called "Cheapest Muppet Movie Ever Made"

You feel how I felt trying to watch the French Muppet Show from a few years ago. I just didnt feel like I was watching the *actual* Muppets.

IMHO, Disney most certainly should not issue a press release or make a formal statement of any kind. I said this elsewhere, but one of the greatest PR advantages the Muppets have is that the news media treats them like actual celebrities. Sure, the people on the Today Show have a little childish grin on their faces, but they just go with it.

Well especially when you're in the direct presence of a Muppeteer performing a Muppet character. It's an astonishing trick, even my friends I brought who arent Muppet fans couldnt access the part of their mind telling them its "just a puppet". There's a certain hypnosis or illusion, and thats why no media outlet thinks of them as just some lambchop or mr rogers puppet.

And...I think the improv on the fly dialogue goes a long way in fostering that illusion.

And yeah, only the online Disneyana/Jim Hill/D23 geeks care about
the technical information and backroom politics of Disneyland/WDW and Disney affairs. Disney could fire each and every long time employee from their roster and company and Joe Public wouldnt even raise an eyebrow.

 

[SarahOnBway]

To bash Artie is unfair as maybe he's not the best Kermit right now but I highly doubt any of us here can do any better and being he has been a participant to our boards in the past, we should be excited and happy for him. All these negative posts are sad to read.

No offense, but this doesn't sit right with me. Why should we applaud a mediocre performance just because we can't do any better ourselves? That's not the nature of criticism, and it's not the nature of fandom either. What, so people shouldn't have complained about that whole Gonzo "those are my nipples" quotes if they couldn't have written something better themselves?

As people who have shared a board with Artie, I think the overall consensus has been that we ARE happy for him, in a "way to go, man, that's awesome that you're living the dream." That said, I'm sure he can understand--from the fan perspective--what it's like to have the rug pulled out from under you with a performer switch like this. There is no reason for us to temper down our feelings because he posts on the board. He has become a performer, and we his audience. And like all audiences, we have the ability--and the right--to judge what we see.

IMHO, Disney most certainly should not issue a press release or make a formal statement of any kind. I said this elsewhere, but one of the greatest PR advantages the Muppets have is that the news media treats them like actual celebrities. Sure, the people on the Today Show have a little childish grin on their faces, but they just go with it.

The only people who look beneath the Muppets are "Fanboys" -- the type of people who post on MuppetCentral or ToughPigs and those Jim-Hill-type people who are fascinated learning what type of fiberglass they're using on the latest Disneyland attraction.

This is definitely true, the media does act as if the Muppets are real people. Kermit is invited for interviews, not Steve. Jim was another figure altogether--he was the head of the company and a celebrity himself so it was different, almost more acceptable, for his presence to be acknowledged whilst performing. He did interviews where he talked and then Kermit talked, but we haven't seen that from anyone since he passed.

Still though, not only do I still feel it needs to be explained to us, but I think, if Steve is done, there needs to be some acknowledgment on Disney's part to the work he has done for the past 19 years (and if he's done altogether with the Muppets, for the past 31 years). He needs to be thanked and applauded for all he has done for us. If there was never a Steve Whitmire, who knows where the Muppets would be today.

 

[Kynan Barker]

[Disney] might not know what's going on either, and are unable to comment because they don't have any information.

Lylle Breier has responded to my email (and to emails from other fans) with the following statement:

We also absolutely appreciate constructive criticism, which brings me to your comments about Kermit. I can assure you that if we ever decide to substitute a performer, we do not do so lightly or arbitrarily, only after careful consideration. Beyond that, however, I hope you can understand that we are not in a position to discuss our private business dealings with any performer.

Disney's comment is that they have no comment. This doesn't mean that Disney doesn't "know what's going on." It means it's not our business what's going on behind the scenes.

Now, if Disney were to have problems with Steve, wouldn't it just make sense for the other performers who have worked for them so far to get angry enough to quit or "strike" out of solidarity?

That's simply not logical. If Disney is willing to replace Kermit's performer, that doesn't put the other performers in a strong position to "strike" or do anything else "out of solidarity."

This came up time and again during the last recasting controversy. But the truth is, we don't and can't know what's going through the Muppeteers' minds. Nor should we.

The fact that Dave, Bill and Eric are still performing the Muppets doesn't prove anything one way or the other -- except that Dave, Bill and Eric still support the Muppets.

 

[Kynan Barker]

To bash Artie is unfair as maybe he's not the best Kermit right now but I highly doubt any of us here can do any better and being he has been a participant to our boards in the past, we should be excited and happy for him.

Nobody's bashing Artie. And criticizing his Kermit doesn't mean we're not excited or happy for him. Being happy for him as a person and being happy with his performance are two very different things.

By your logic, Disney could pick any random one of us to play a major Muppet, and everyone else here should be thrilled, regardless of the result. Participating in the fan community doesn't give you any special rights as a performer.

All these negative posts are sad to read.

What's really sad is that people are willing to accept less than "the best Kermit" in the name of being positive. I think Kermit deserves the best. Don't you?

EDITED TO ADD:

Just realized someone else said it better, and sooner:

No offense, but this doesn't sit right with me. Why should we applaud a mediocre performance just because we can't do any better ourselves? That's not the nature of criticism, and it's not the nature of fandom either.

What Sarah said.

 

[frogboy4]

What's really sad is that people are willing to accept less than "the best Kermit" in the name of being positive. I think Kermit deserves the best. Don't you?

I agree with you 100%. I'm still hoping this is a momentary snag that will get cleared up soon. I can't imagine a new Muppet movie without Steve under the frog.

One thing that keeps being brought up is new characters for both old and new performers. As long as we get a mix of Kermit, Fozzie, Scooter, Rowlf, Floyd and the gang I have no issue with another new character of Pepe or even Bean Bunny stature making it into the mix. I'm sure Artie's got a bizillion ideas for them and it would be fantastic for him to have a signature Muppet that will be placed on mugs, t-shirts and keychains!

 

[beaker]

Lylle Breier has responded to my email (and to emails from other fans) with the following statement:

We also absolutely appreciate constructive criticism, which brings me to your comments about Kermit. I can assure you that if we ever decide to substitute a performer, we do not do so lightly or arbitrarily, only after careful consideration. Beyond that, however, I hope you can understand that we are not in a position to discuss our private business dealings with any performer.

Disney's comment is that they have no comment. This doesn't mean that Disney doesn't "know what's going on." It means it's not our business what's going on behind the scenes.



That's simply not logical. If Disney is willing to replace Kermit's performer, that doesn't put the other performers in a strong position to "strike" or do anything else "out of solidarity."

This came up time and again during the last recasting controversy. But the truth is, we don't and can't know what's going through the Muppeteers' minds. Nor should we.

The fact that Dave, Bill and Eric are still performing the Muppets doesn't prove anything one way or the other -- except that Dave, Bill and Eric still support the Muppets.

Thanks for posting the email. Not sure it illuminates or alleviates one way or the other...again a part of me thinks people are bending out of shape over what could very well just be a few week or month hiatus for Whitmire. But the fan community has been surprised before my seemingly jarring news before.

Another dimension regarding Dave Bill and Eric still working, is that the reality is people gotta make a living. While we'd all like to think that if the mouse let go of Whitmire's services that they'd put up a big fuss. However, in the world of tv shows/film series/cartoons/sports often times this is not the case and it bears no reflection on those who stay other than work is work and business is business.

Look how in the final years of JHC NYC they fired a bunch of Muppet builders, same with Sesame Workshop in recent time.

 

[dwayne1115]

I think it's really the question that is in queston.

Now don't get me wrong I love Steve's work but I really think the main question is Has Kermit been Re cast, or is Artie just an understudy.

To dive into the depth of why or how would be to much for Disney Steve or Artie to get into becuaese it could be many or any different reasons.
The main and really only thing that us fans should be has Kermit been recast, and let the why and how fall into place latter on.

I can understand why Steve and Artie have not said anything because If Artie is takeing over then there may be hard feelings and things may not be set in stone yet as well.

 

[ferrell]

here's a copy of what I posted earlier which seems to have been lost in this thread..please read..

I seem to remember a few months back Disney was saying that they are looking for New muppet voice actors for promotional uses and various small projects..it was somewhere on this board , I find it hard to think that people have already forgotten about it,I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Steve was not fired and isn't Ill (or isn't deathly ill) and that we would have heard something from either Steve,his family,Disney,the henson company,or one of the muppeters if he had been,and the fact that we haven't heard anything from any of them means that he wasn't fired or is deathly sick..now again I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Steve is probably real busy right now working on various projects,remember we have Fraggle Rock movie,a muppet movie, dark crystal 2 and he may still be doing stuff here and there for sesame street and maybe even more stuff that we don't know about for the Henson company,we know that there are muppeters that come to this board and since no one has said anything of a negative nature chances are we are all blowing this out of porportion,why doesn't Artie say anything it's simple it could simply be a claus in his contract which says he can't say certain things..also chances are Steve probably approved of who would carry on the voice of Kermit or who would be his understudy,so let's give Artie a break,I read this thread first before hearing his kermit and was expecting someone horrible like someone you would hear on Dr Demento but when I heard it I was surprised at how much he sounded like Jim,sure he has some stuff to work on but IF he was approved by Steve let's give him a chance to work on the character,I trust Steve's judgement..after all Steve can't be 2 places at once and the Muppets NEED promotion and it's good that Disney is promoting them..

 

[Luke]

Well Lylle Breier's email seems to imply its a business issue so it definitely doesn't sound like he's just away working on something else or ill. I guess she could have wrote business if its an availability problem but i think if it was that they would have just come out and said it and not even entertained the idea of a substitute performer.

I bet if the media made a thing of this whatever the reason is would be revealed.