On Writing Fan Fiction (Rules & Advice)

[Ruahnna]

Well, I know my take on this is probably off-center, because I rarely seem to find myself on the "typical side of things, but I don't usualy want a lot of description for characters I already know, and I don't necessarily want a lot of description for a character that is original--unless it's relevant to the story. Sometimes a little goes a long way. With fanfic, unlike any other type of fiction writing, there is already a known character (or several)--a character that doesn't belong to the author of the fanfic. As such, that character already has a look--either from the actor who portrays the character, or the created object (like a muppet or puppet) or from some other visual representation, such as comic book characters. Therefore, I don't need someone to tell me that Kermit is, for exampe, a GREEN frog--I'd much prefer they describe him to me in term of personality, i.e., "Kermit the Frog had not yet reached the level of arm-waving hysteria, but his scrunchy face and snarky tone said he wasn't far from it." Because I know Kermit, this is enough for me. If someone uses a character that I don't know very well, I don't mind looking them up--I'm two clicks away from where the story is posted if I feel like I NEED to see what they look like. If the author creates a character, then a bit more description in necessary, but I want just enough to create a picture of them in my own mind. I HAVE a good imagination--I don't mind to use it.

With original characters, it's a little more problematic, isn't it? The author is often VERY interested in telling the reader ALL ABOUT the character created. The reader is not always as interested. I've seen many a Star Trek fanfic screech to a halt while someone took waaay too many paragraphs to describe what a character looked like, what they wore, etc., when those things weren't relevant to the story. I like it better when a character is slowly unveiled through action and interaction--I'm much more interested in whether their step is brisk or their tone firm than whether or not the OC has long, honey-blond hair falling in ringlets down her slim tan back that perfectly accentuated the cut of her jib, not to mentioned her state-of-the-art space suit that perfectly set off the irridescent silver eye-shadow that so complimented the dark grey of her eyes--except when she was angry, in which case they were VERY dark grey. Um, where was I?

Oh! Oh yes. A good story-teller--especially one who does so with WRITTEN words, does research on the character and the character's individual traits so that they can inhabit the character believably. A GREAT story-teller can avoid boring the audience with everything they know, until and unless it becomes relevant to the story.

That's my take on it--or at least my preference. Everyone else is cordially invited to express their own opinion!

 

[Yva Minstrel]

Well, I know my take on this is probably off-center, because I rarely seem to find myself on the "typical side of things, but I don't usualy want a lot of description for characters I already know, and I don't necessarily want a lot of description for a character that is original--unless it's relevant to the story.

I just want to clarify that when I said I get into description, I don't mean that I write the characters in such a way that one can grow quickly aggravated by the description. However, when I introduce a character into the story, I do describe the canon characters a tiny bit. Of course, I loved your Kermit description, that was a brilliant way to describe him. I could actually see him in my mind's eye as I was reading that one sentence. So, yes, very effective storytelling there. Frogs are generally green in color, so I also see the 'useless' description there.

The only time when I think physical descriptions are vital are in crossovers when a reader perhaps knows one fandom and not the other, then it becomes hard for someone to read a story and actually follow what is going on without the description. That is, if I wrote a 'Fraggle Rock' crossover with 'Willy Wonka and the Chocolage Factory', then for the Wonka fans, I'd have to describe the fraggles, and for the fraggle fans I'd have to describe the characters from my chosen Wonkaverse. With original characters, unless you have some sort of description about them, then no one will be able to see into the writer's mind. Since I have written a novel, then I think that the original characters are sometimes easier than the canon characters. Of course, being someone who cannot tolerate Mary Sues (the perfect character with the flowing hair etc.), I can see wherre original characters can come off over the top. My rule of thumb is to describe the character a little, and as the story progresses, add small details about him/her. That generally helps with keeping the 'Sueisms' out of the story.

I know that we don't need 2 pages of description about a character, but it also helps when we have more than just a brief overview. And when we can use description, your example is spot on as to how we can play with the language.

So while I can see where you're coming from, and don't think it's off center in the least, I think that there is such a thing as too much of a good thing.

In all honesty, when I was talking about description, I wasn't just referring to people or characters, but I was also referring to the places where they are. If two characters are sitting around 'chewing the fat', and there's no description as to where they are, then one could very easily assume that they are on a roller coaster, or at a loud disco, when the writer actually intended for them to be inside a church or sitting on the banks of a peaceful and quiet river. So, yeah, there can be too much description at times.

Your words about keeping it relavant to the story is really well stated, btw.

 

[RedPiggy]

The only time when I think physical descriptions are vital are in crossovers when a reader perhaps knows one fandom and not the other, then it becomes hard for someone to read a story and actually follow what is going on without the description.

Well, that, and I also try to write fics for my Mom, who knows very little about the characters I know about. So, no matter who is "canon", she just isn't going to get them if I don't manipulate the story to evoke their character. I consider it a challenge to write for non-fans. I also like taking one-note characters or background characters (I prefer it if they have a name but just wasn't a big part of the plot) and putting them in the foreground.

 

[RedPiggy]

Well, look at the DC thing: whatever we all thought of it, the fact still remains that it just gave a fraction of a taste of the characters involved. It supposedly got some people interested. Some people probably also just shrugged and changed the channel. And I don't just mean the Muppet parts ... I don't watch the Tweens so I got a bare taste of them whereas non-Muppet fans got a bare taste of Muppets. The thing is, if you want to argue that a character is worth knowing, it helps if a story can back it up. I'm not saying stories that assume fandom are bad. I'm only saying that some stories (not naming names ... for the most part I find the fics here to be enjoyable ... but I'm a fan) perhaps assume too much, making it seem like an outline or a pitch rather than a story. Imagine if all of Harry Potter had been summed up (and it probably could have) in a short story. Would it have had the same emotional impact? Would the successes and failures of certain characters have the same emotional "oompf"? I doubt it. That's not to say a short story involving the characters wouldn't work ... but it's the difference between eating a protein bar and an actual meal. One might have the same amount of nutrition as the other (or it may not) ... but sometimes it feels better to get the meal.

 

[Redsonga]

I'm not a fan of the stories that are just outlines but as far as actual short stories go I think it might be a little hard on them to say that just because they aren't novel length they don't have true impact. Half of the later Harry Potter books, most of all the last two, could have been edited down and they would have been much better books for it IMHO (Argh, now I have scenes of Red and Gobo camping night after night after night after night after night running though my mind..and OMG... it's getting shippy ! Down you two! Not in my imagination!!)
I dunno, in the case of my own stories, I could make them longer, but good luck ever seeing an ending then . My style just does not like to be any longer than the story..and if it is forced to be it starts to go on for paragraphs and paragraphs of internal monologue (even though I love this story dearly, I have be writing it for five years now. Years. I think my inner Mokey is trying to tell me something ) ...I guess that could be emotional to the reader, but not the sort of emotion that makes happy thoughts for a lot of them.

 

[TogetherAgain]

As for length of stories, I think it depends on the story and what the author is comfortable with. Personally, I would love to write shorter stories... but my stories very strongly disagree with me on the matter. (My signature, "My mind's own mind has a mind of its own," is a rough explanation of about how much control I feel like I have over my stories.)

As a reader, though, here's my issue with excessive amounts of description: I get so overwhelmed with details that I forget them and picture the scene or OC in a way that completely contradicts what the author intended. On the other hand, with too little description, a trait may come up halfway through the story that contradicts how I've been "seeing" the character-- What? She has LONG hair that has to be cut now because it got caught in the branches? And here I've been picturing her hair at about chin-length... (That's a random example that I don't think has ever actually happened to me as a reader, but as a writer I once tried to reveal a character's presence in a particular scene by describing him... only to realize that I'd never given any hint as to what he looked like!)

So personally, I like to see (and like to think that I write) a general overview of the scene or character that has as much to do with the feel as the look, (I don't need to know whether or not there's crown molding, but is the room dark and dusty, or bright and clean? I don't need to know which cheek has more freckles than the other, but is the character slouching or standing tall?) and then mention other details as they come up. (Oh, there's a stack of dishes on the table? Okie dokie.)

 

[Fozzie Bear]

When posting a new Fan Fiction, please start the title with:

FF: Gonzo's Nose

This will keep the titles from being confused as other articles on the forum.

 

[Gonzo14]

I've got a very very basic outline of a fanfic that i've had for over a year now, i've got bits and pieces figured out, just gotta get them all organized sometime, i'll let you all know if i figure it out

 

[Muppetfan44]

My take on this topic

I finally have had the chance to read this thread the whole way through and wanted to offer my take on the subject. After reading tons and tons of wonderful stories and writing a few myself, there are things I look for when reading every fanfic and things I wish I didn't see. Most of everything I'll say has been posted previously on this thread, but I hope I offer a different take on it:

I completely agree with everyone who said that character integrity is one of the most important things to keep in mind when writing fan fiction. If you are not true to the character and have them doing all sorts of things that all of us die-hard fans know that they would never do, the story loses quality, credibility, and interest all at the same time.

Originally posted by EleganceLiberty
Oscar wouldn't go 'Grand Theft Auto' on a kid and Boober certainly doesn't slit his wrists and listen to Evanesence.

Like that...I think this is one of my favorite quotes on the forums ever because it is hilarious and oh so true! If people start writing stuff like this in their stories, I stop reading immediatlely because I just can't believe stuff like that would happen..which brings me to my next point

Believability
Along with character integrity, if someone's story is just way to out there in general, I stop reading because I can't believe in the story itself. Now I'm not saying that the Muppets can't turn into super-heroes or other fantasy stuff like that--you can still write stories like that (with fantasy elements) while maintaining the believability in your story (character integrity helps out a lot here), but if you have the Muppets being sent to another dimension, speaking different languages, mutating, while taking over the planet.....hopefully you get the picture... If a story is just wayyyy to out there and not grounded in hardly any reality, it is too difficult for me as a reader to place and see the real Muppet characters in that story. One of the things I love about good fan fiction is when while reading it, I can literally picture myself off to side, like I'm watching it happening in real life and I think believability really goes to that and makes the quality of fan fiction so much better


Keeping all of the senses in mind
I completely agree with everyone that stresses to use all the senses in writing, writing what the character sees, hears, smells, etc. If a writer can do this effectively, it raises the quality of the story ten-fold and your readers can definitely see the story, feel the story, etc and it makes reading fan fiction so much more intense and enjoyable.

Planning
I think that planning a story ahead of time to some degree is VITAL to the success of a fan fic. This comes mostly from my writing experience because I find it extremely difficult to sit down and write a story if I don't have some idea how it starts and how it ends. Now this doesn't mean you have to know exactly how everything happens but I know at least for me, I need some road map of how the story will progress so I can spend my time working on all the details in between that make a story vibrant and exciting. If I'm to focused on major plot points, I lose sight of all the wonderful little things in a fan-fic that really raise the quality, like a character's reaction to a joke or including those wonderful Muppet and pop culture reference we all love so much.

And from my experience as a reader...I just hate it when a good story loses momentum in the middle and there is a long, long gap before the story gets updated. I know a lot of people do this and I want to make sure that I'm not criticizing anyone for doing this, because I understand how stories can fall to the wayside with everyone's busy lives. Some of the best fic writers can pick up a story they stopped working on years ago and write as if no time has passed. But....as a reader it is so sad when great stories are started and never finished. When I am writing I try to give myself a rough timeline and try to post updates on a somewhat regular schedule so as not to discourage any of my readers. One of the reasons I write fan-fiction so that others can enjoy the story as much as I do, and I feel like people enjoy stories less if the story stops and is not picked up after a long time. I'm sure people differ in opinion but that is just how I feel about it.

New Characters
I tend not to like new characters being added to stories because to some degree I think you lose believability when creating a new character. This is not true in all cases though. Sometimes someone just does fantastically in creating a new character that it can be pulled off, but because of how well the Muppets mesh and work together as a group and nearly encompass almost any character trait you can imagine, trying to add a new character just doesn't work a lot of the time. If you can describe a character well enough that anyone can easily picture them, especially picture them with the muppets then maybe it'll work, but most of the time it just doesn't. I'm sure that's the same if you were writing for any group of popular characters.

Spelling, grammar, and all that good stuff is important too, but the more you write, the better you get at the technical stuff. I would rather someone focus more time on character and plot development more than worry about commas, paragraph structure, tense, and all that other stuff.

Well that's all I can think of, but like so many people have said before, never get discouraged if someone is trying to give you constructive criticism. Also, if you just don't agree with someone's criticism, don't follow it. Thank them for their input but respectfully disagree. Everyone has a different opinion and the most important thing about your story is that it's your story! If in the end you enjoy it and no one else does, who cares! Like Ru always says, write becasue you want to.

I can't wait to start writing fan fiction again... I hopefully will be able to start my new story in the next few days. Keep up the good writing everyone!

 

[RedPiggy]

I think this is one of my favorite quotes on the forums ever because it is hilarious and oh so true!

LOL, and the funny thing is ... even if I wanted to write a fanfic parody where I forced all of that in there ... it'd still sound wrong.

Now I'm not saying that the Muppets can't turn into super-heroes or other fantasy stuff like that

Well, I think I've only written Grover as Super Grover and Red as Princess Gwenalot ... but it's clear that they're just dressing up, though technically I could argue that Grover can actually fly when in costume, since it happens on the show and in FTB. However, I write them more as just LARPing (thank you, Nostalgia Chick, for teaching me a new word, LOL).

If a writer can do this effectively, it raises the quality of the story ten-fold and your readers can definitely see the story, feel the story, etc and it makes reading fan fiction so much more intense and enjoyable.

Personally, while I'll read and be nice to stories that are ... rather ... bare in the description department, I prefer stories written as though publishing was honestly a thought that crossed their minds. I like stories where it would seem plausible it could be a book in real bookstores. I truly despise "script" stories, namely because they aren't really written as script but just lines of dialogue that assumes you can read the author's mind about what is going on, as the dialogue is rarely helpful. Now, I'll give a favorable review anyway if I can see a wonderful story concept ... but to me, they are ONLY a concept, not a "real" story. And don't get me started on "outlines" ... those have to be the most pointless things ever (no offense to those who post them). In my opinion, those aren't even close to stories ... those are what you write on sticky notes thinking about what to write as an actual story. On fanfiction.net, I got a nitpicky review (one of my few) on my Comeback King Saga, griping about all my description. I felt like shaking this person and saying, "YOU'VE GOTTEN SPOILED BY A BUNCH OF CHEAP FANFICS WHERE IT'S JUST REALLY AN OUTLINE IN PARAGRAPH FORM!" Well, that, and I explained that I was writing that way because some of my readers are visually impaired and ... even if they weren't ... good description helps set mood as well as move the plot. I could say that Jenny's office was cluttered with stuff ... or I could show the reader what was actually in her office, so that we would know some more about her character. What is better, saying Jenny's walls are covered in Broadway posters -- OR -- saying that Manhattan Melodies was slightly faded but framed on the wall? One will get the plot moving along barely, BUT ... the latter shows how Jenny feels about a moment in her past. There are too many fanfics in the world where we are forced to imagine what was in the author's head. I don't want to play telepath. I want to be in their world, not catch the Viewmaster version.

I just hate it when a good story loses momentum in the middle

I admit my second act to Comeback lost a bit of "epicness" from the first act. Partly, it's due to the original stories being stand-alone instead of included in a "box set". The second act was meant to focus more on the Muppet side of the story that followed up what happened in Act One. However, admittedly, I wasn't satisfied with it completely and it's why I'm writing Skeeter Rock, to "fix" some issues, LOL. It's still using Skeeter to talk about choosing one's life, but I don't feel I explored her storyline adequately in Comeback.

I tend not to like new characters being added to stories because to some degree I think you lose believability when creating a new character. This is not true in all cases though. Sometimes someone just does fantastically in creating a new character that it can be pulled off, but because of how well the Muppets mesh and work together as a group and nearly encompass almost any character trait you can imagine, trying to add a new character just doesn't work a lot of the time.

I can't stand making up my own characters. I prefer, at the most, just taking a background character and deepening them out a bit. I work best when there's something to go on. I've only invented a couple of Muppet characters (Crooner Fraggle, the ancestor to Cantus and John, is my personal favorite) because I like exploring existing stuff (admittedly, because it's easier for me to write, LOL).