The New Am I The Only One Thread

[LittleJerry92]

My childhood is a lie.

 

[antsamthompson9]

Here's my source: http://muppet.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:243664 That would be a great thing to surprise Frank Oz with on his Reddit AMA.

 

[fuzzygobo]

Maybe it took a while to say "Wocka Wocka", but in the beginning his ears wiggled.

 

[Pig'sSaysAdios]

Maybe it took a while to say "Wocka Wocka", but in the beginning his ears wiggled.

Yeah, I wish they had kept that.

 

[LittleJerry92]

Okay, bringing this back up:

Am I the only one who finds it ridiculous that people are saying "Gender and sex are not the same thing" and people get too overly sensitive/offended if you bring up this subject because they go on tumblr too much?

I'm changing my statement on this.

Am I the only one who thinks people are just debating on this subject too much?

Like, if there are people out there who want to identify as the opposite gender of their sex, good for them. But I also wish those who do choose to live that way would just let others think what they want instead of being like "omg if u think jender and sex r the same shame on u!!!!1111!!!!" Since some aren't ready to accept the fact, and likewise, I wish people would leave those who do say what they identity as out of respect alone instead of just being like "guhhh u have mental issues!" End of the day just leave people to their business.

 

[Blue Frackle]

Here's my source: http://muppet.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:243664 That would be a great thing to surprise Frank Oz with on his Reddit AMA.

That was one of the top questions:

In The Muppet Movie script, Fozzie was doing a comedy act on stage where Kermit first saw him, but there was no comedy act written, so I just made one up -- and what you see on screen is what I showed Jim in an empty sound stage about a week before. And he loved it, so I kept it. And it really is a steal from old fashioned burlesque comedians.

 

[CensoredAlso]

Like, if there are people out there who want to identify as the opposite gender of their sex, good for them. But I also wish those who do choose to live that way would just let others think what they want instead of being like "omg if u think jender and sex r the same shame on u!!!!1111!!!!"

I think you have a very fair outlook on the issue.

 

[jvcarroll]

Okay, bringing this back up:



I'm changing my statement on this.

Am I the only one who thinks people are just debating on this subject too much?

Like, if there are people out there who want to identify as the opposite gender of their sex, good for them. But I also wish those who do choose to live that way would just let others think what they want instead of being like "omg if u think jender and sex r the same shame on u!!!!1111!!!!" Since some aren't ready to accept the fact, and likewise, I wish people would leave those who do say what they identity as out of respect alone instead of just being like "guhhh u have mental issues!" End of the day just leave people to their business.

I get that and honor it. You can't tell people what to believe or force them to do so, but that's not really the point. At least, not among most rational people. As long as you respect others (by that, I mean using their chosen name and preferred pronouns when addressing them without debating them about that), your personal views on the matter are fine. However, if one makes an innocent mistake when talking to someone who's trans or non-gender-conforming, and that person gets upset rather than graciously attempts to let them know the error, then that's on them, not you. Those things are not always immediately obvious and we're not clairvoyant.


My question is this: With all that comes up in your daily life, how many times has this? I don't mean just talking about the subject, but how many times in your daily life have you encountered non-gender-conforming people in order to make this such a big issue for you? Curiousity, I understand. Questions, I understand. But it seems like this doesn't have much of an impact on your daily life one way or another.


I've lived in San Francisco for 23 years, I'm very social, and this seldom comes up for me. I see plenty of black and latino people during my day, but I seldom ever initiate a conversation about how I feel about the political plight their race is facing at the moment and my ideas on it unless some sort of discussion is already taking place. I think the same should go for trans and gender non conforming people. The point is, we should all try to make each other feel comfortable and valued.


An interesting thing happened Thursday night at work. A strikingly beautiful fella, with long hair, flirted with me a little bit. It wasn't until later that I realized SHE was a trans-woman. She was still as cute. Not my type, of course. Nothing wrong with that. If she'd been a trans man, maybe it would have been different. She was definitely someone I could easily be friends with. Who knows? Anyway, most people think things are militant and rigid in SF. The truth is, we're all relatively cool about it all - no matter what our personal opinions on the matter.


In fact, the employee with the record for the most tips in a night was another trans friend who landed me this job! It's just funny for me to see all of these intricacies discussed when I have several such important people in my life and have never found any of it noteworthy. That stuff mostly seems to come up in theoretical discussions.


So in that tradition, here's a theoretical example of how a gracious person would deal with such things:

TRANS PERSON: Hi

YOU OR ME: Hi, sir.

TRANS PERSON: Actually, I go by Jane and I'm a trans woman.

YOU OR ME: Okay. Hi, miss.

The End.

They're not really making a statement. They're just trying to live their lives, so what you or I would think on the matter is irrelevant. If a discussion is brought up, that's when things change. But obliging a person about the name they wish to be called and how they'd like to be addressed is just good manners.

 

[LittleJerry92]

I get that and honor it. You can't tell people what to believe or force them to do so, but that's not really the point. At least, not among most rational people. As long as you respect others (by that, I mean using their chosen name and preferred pronouns when addressing them without debating them about that), your personal views on the matter are fine. However, if one makes an innocent mistake when talking to someone who's trans or non-gender-conforming, and that person gets upset rather than graciously attempts to let them know the error, then that's on them, not you. Those things are not always immediately obvious and we're not clairvoyant.


My question is this: With all that comes up in your daily life, how many times has this? I don't mean just talking about the subject, but how many times in your daily life have you encountered non-gender-conforming people in order to make this such a big issue for you? Curiousity, I understand. Questions, I understand. But it seems like this doesn't have much of an impact on your daily life one way or another.


I've lived in San Francisco for 23 years, I'm very social, and this seldom comes up for me. I see plenty of black and latino people during my day, but I seldom ever initiate a conversation about how I feel about the political plight their race is facing at the moment and my ideas on it unless some sort of discussion is already taking place. I think the same should go for trans and gender non conforming people. The point is, we should all try to make each other feel comfortable and valued.


An interesting thing happened Thursday night at work. A strikingly beautiful fella, with long hair, flirted with me a little bit. It wasn't until later that I realized SHE was a trans-woman. She was still as cute. Not my type, of course. Nothing wrong with that. If she'd been a trans man, maybe it would have been different. She was definitely someone I could easily be friends with. Who knows? Anyway, most people think things are militant and rigid in SF. The truth is, we're all relatively cool about it all - no matter what our personal opinions on the matter.


In fact, the employee with the record for the most tips in a night was another trans friend who landed me this job! It's just funny for me to see all of these intricacies discussed when I have several such important people in my life and have never found any of it noteworthy. That stuff mostly seems to come up in theoretical discussions.


So in that tradition, here's a theoretical example of how a gracious person would deal with such things:

TRANS PERSON: Hi

YOU OR ME: Hi, sir.

TRANS PERSON: Actually, I go by Jane and I'm a trans woman.

YOU OR ME: Okay. Hi, miss.

The End.

They're not really making a statement. They're just trying to live their lives, so what you or I would think on the matter is irrelevant. If a discussion is brought up, that's when things change. But obliging a person about the name they wish to be called and how they'd like to be addressed is just good manners.

Oh I agree, we should all make each other feel welcome. If someone just respectfully tells me "I'd prefer if you refer to me as this" then I'll be like "okay." But if I get the response of "don't you EVER refer to me as that again you bigot!!!!1!!!!" If I say "sir" or "ma'am" then chances are I'm probably never gonna talk to you again.

But in terms of my own social life, I did used to deal with a couple friends (one of whom is bi and the other gay, both good friends of mine) who I've gotten into debates about the whole gender and sex deal and I will say part of it is my fault because I did, out of own stupidity at the time, just kind of act like "there's no such thing as trans" and got into some heated arguments, until they decided to just let me think what I want until I feel ready to accept it (even back when I was a teenager I had an issue accepting gay people into my life until I just learned that they're people too).

But what mostly made me feel "anti-gender identity" at the time was this one girl in my college named Molly who literally forces you to believe what she wants to and then plays the victim if you don't agree with her even out of respect (the friend I mentioned that was bi even ended up chewing her out for it on one of my Facebook posts when I was still anti trans/gender identity cause he knew I wasn't ready to accept it). I no longer have her in my life and am glad I don't because I don't respect people who try and guilt card others just because they don't agree with each other even if it just may be a "to each their own" belief attitude.

It just took me a while to learn some people do believe they were born in the wrong sex which I can understand why that would be frustrating. So I eventually just learned to accept it because end of the day, we're only humans and we live the life we want to live. I have some (very wonderful) friends who still think the only genders are male and female and that's fine. End of the day it's their beliefs and they aren't the types to go off on others and be like "wow, you have such a mental problem."

I actually ended up unfollowing one guy on Facebook who has a very bigoted alt-right view because he constantly nags on gay marriage and the LGBT group and I'm just like "alright, enough's enough."

 

[jvcarroll]

Oh I agree, we should all make each other feel welcome. If someone just respectfully tells me "I'd prefer if you refer to me as this" then I'll be like "okay." But if I get the response of "don't you EVER refer to me as that again you bigot!!!!1!!!!" If I say "sir" or "ma'am" then chances are I'm probably never gonna talk to you again.

But in terms of my own social life, I did used to deal with a couple friends (one of whom is bi and the other gay, both good friends of mine) who I've gotten into debates about the whole gender and sex deal and I will say part of it is my fault because I did, out of own stupidity at the time, just kind of act like "there's no such thing as trans" and got into some heated arguments, until they decided to just let me think what I want until I feel ready to accept it (even back when I was a teenager I had an issue accepting gay people into my life until I just learned that they're people too).

But what mostly made me feel "anti-gender identity" at the time was this one girl in my college named Molly who literally forces you to believe what she wants to and then plays the victim if you don't agree with her even out of respect (the friend I mentioned that was bi even ended up chewing her out for it on one of my Facebook posts when I was still anti trans/gender identity cause he knew I wasn't ready to accept it). I no longer have her in my life and am glad I don't because I don't respect people who try and guilt card others just because they don't agree with each other even if it just may be a "to each their own" belief attitude.

It just took me a while to learn some people do believe they were born in the wrong sex which I can understand why that would be frustrating. So I eventually just learned to accept it because end of the day, we're only humans and we live the life we want to live. I have some (very wonderful) friends who still think the only genders are male and female and that's fine. End of the day it's their beliefs and they aren't the types to go off on others and be like "wow, you have such a mental problem."

I actually ended up unfollowing one guy on Facebook who has a very bigoted alt-right view because he constantly nags on gay marriage and the LGBT group and I'm just like "alright, enough's enough."

Agreed - with enthusiasm!

There's no worse way to show someone a new point of view than to shame them. Some of those people are toxic, but not all. It's difficult because it's our natural inclination to be tribal as humans and to lash out against those who'd threaten those within our group. What that girl did to you wasn't a productive or kind tactic. It was self serving.


The thing that always comes back to me in life is this one question: Do I want my world to be bigger and richer or smaller and shrinking? I only have a few very close friends, but I'm very friendly to those around me and see in everyone an opportunity to make a new friend of some kind. Opening up to people with whom I share very little in common is the pathway to making my world greater and richer.


The first thing I do with any new person I meet is to try to make them feel as comfortable as possible just for being who they are. I don't necessarily mean politically - beyond that - who they are to their root. I was made to feel so closed off in my formative years that I won't allow anyone to feel that for one moment, if I can help it, when they're out with me. I had a choice very early on about which path to go: to shut down and sulk or to rise up and help.


The only types of people that it doesn't work with are the chronically unhappy. Those who give up on humanity without realizing that means giving up on themselves too. I've always had a hard time with them. It's not depression. It's something much more insidious than that. Those types of people will suck you in and leave you low. Don't try to cheer those people up. They're content in their misery and that life owes them something that it does not. I politely bow out with those sorts of folk. But that's actually rare. Those are among the sociopaths I was referring to on the other thread. Social media, particularly, is filled with those types. Eugh. Delete.


We all get what we get in life. No use feeling angry or guilty about that. It's what we do with it and how we treat others that's important. What's even more important is how we deal with things when we've fallen short. Do we get defensive or do we take responsibility for what we are able and try to make things better? As long as we try to be the latter, we're on the right path. The rest is simply noise.


Your reply says to me that you're on the right path with good intentions. You have different views than me, but I don't think you're a bad person. On the contrary. I think you're a good guy who just wants to be understood and valued like everybody else. That means that there's no reason that I should treat you any differently than I would treat a trans person in my life or the number of conservative friends I have with whom I disagree, but appreciate very much.