Pixar: Are the glory days over?

[Drtooth]

Not to get off the main topic, but if I was somehow turned into a candelabra, a clock, a teapot, or whatever by a sorceress, I think my boss' happiness would be pretty low on my list of priorities, too, in favor of doing whatever it took to get me out of that form. Just saying, it doesn't make them "jerks."

Oh yeah. I mean, it's totally the Beast's fault for them being like that in the first place, and they definitely should be racing to have any solution to become human again. Still, they seem more concerned about forcing them together to become human. Not so much jerks, but a little selfish. Selfish for justifiable reasons... but what would happen if the Beast and Belle truly hated each other no matter what?

Herald has a better angle on my than I do. It's still a great movie, just the characters are kinda unlikable if you dwell on it. At least the characters aren't plastic tropes like Pocahontas is. Which is sad, since Katzenberg (the same guy who almost ruined Toy Story) wanted a preachy Oscar Bait movie instead of a the wacky fun adventure they originally planned. A John Candy voiced Turkey. We lost something big there.

 

[Dominicboo1]

Not to get off the main topic, but if I was somehow turned into a candelabra, a clock, a teapot, or whatever by a sorceress, I think my boss' happiness would be pretty low on my list of priorities, too, in favor of doing whatever it took to get me out of that form. Just saying, it doesn't make them "jerks."


I haven't seen all of the Pixar movies, to get back on topic, but the ones I've seen have left me greatly underwhelmed. I thought the characters in the first Toy Story movie ranged from obnoxious, to silly, to just plain nasty (if we want to talk about characters being jerks), though I was 8 when I saw that, so maybe that was just me being a sensitive kid. I though A Bug's Life was annoying, and the first Cars wasn't much to write home about (although I have some fondness for it being one of George Carlin's last films). The only Pixar movies I've seen that I can say I actually like are Finding Nemo and Up. Heck, I think the first ten minutes of Up could have been just a nice little short film in themselves. I haven't seen Brave yet, though I've wanted to; I just haven't got around to it yet.

See more of them! Especially Monsters Inc. and Wall.e! Oh, and Toy Story 2 and 3 are slightly better than the first, so you may enjoy them.

 

[Sgt Floyd]

See more of them! Especially Monsters Inc. and Wall.e! Oh, and Toy Story 2 and 3 are slightly better than the first, so you may enjoy them.

Funny, you just named all the Pixar movies I don't like

Really, I just don't like Pixar that much. Toy Story 1 I am biased towards because it has sentimental value, but overall, I can't think of a recent Pixar movie that I have loved. Monsters Inc was meh, I thought Wall E was offensive (dur hurr, look at the fat people who can't do anything by themselves, durr hurr), Cars, again, was meh, and from a personal fear was not exactly comfortable to watch. Toy Story 2 was convoluted and had a terrible plot, and Toy Story 3 had an extremely cliche, overdone "The Great Escape" rip off plot.

Come to think of it, I can't really name a pixar movie that I genuinely enjoy.

 

[D'Snowth]

WALL-E, story-wise, was interesting, it didn't have just a whole lot to offer, mainly due to the limited dialogue, but other than that, I think it's one of Pixar's more eye-candy feats, it certainly has a lot of beautiful animation. I can understand being people offended my the fat people aspect, however, as a fat person myself, I actually WASN'T offended by it, but rather, I saw it as a satire of just how increasingly lazy mankind is becoming in our technologically-advanced world.

MONSTER'S, INC. I can find no flaws with, same with any of the TOY STORY movies.

 

[Sgt Floyd]

I'm just weird then

I mean, I do understand what they were trying to get across with Wall E, and scientifically it wouldn't be so far off either, but I really thought Disney would have been better than once again, planting the idea in peoples heads that fat people are lazy, eating machines that deserve to be made fun of :/

 

[Drtooth]

I thought Wall E was offensive (dur hurr, look at the fat people who can't do anything by themselves, durr hurr),

You completely missed the point, then.

The humans weren't fat because they were lazy and did nothing under their own power, they were fat because they were in an artificial gravity for anywhere from decades to a century. They did the research that no other sci-fi based project did. The fact that, that many years in space, the human race would lose all bone density and not be able to do things under their own power if they wanted to. It does have a slightly cloying message about anti-consumerism and using technology to wish problems away message with a touch of Green Aesop. However, I think the true message is beware the inevitable corporate political interests. And blah blah blah, politics politics politics... lobbyists blah blah blah... important lesson for Americans to learn.

That said, I've come to hate the term "cliche." Sure, there are those who have a big book of stock plots (mainly 70's and 80's cartoon show writers... don't wanna name names), and then there are those who use said cliches artistically. Remember, every single story has been told, and everything has been done. You cannot possibly have a narrative without being a ripoff of something else. The only way to avoid cliches is nonsense. And even nonsense has been done. The point is, story tellers don't need to avoid copying something else as long as they're not doing it on purpose, but storytellers dang sure need to avoid copying themselves.

 

[Sgt Floyd]

You completely missed the point, then.

The humans weren't fat because they were lazy and did nothing under their own power, they were fat because they were in an artificial gravity for anywhere from decades to a century.

Hi, you missed my previous post then

I'm just weird then

I mean, I do understand what they were trying to get across with Wall E, and scientifically it wouldn't be so far off either, but I really thought Disney would have been better than once again, planting the idea in peoples heads that fat people are lazy, eating machines that deserve to be made fun of :/

 

[CensoredAlso]

Oh yeah. I mean, it's totally the Beast's fault for them being like that in the first place, and they definitely should be racing to have any solution to become human again. Still, they seem more concerned about forcing them together to become human. Not so much jerks, but a little selfish. Selfish for justifiable reasons... but what would happen if the Beast and Belle truly hated each other no matter what?

Well if they hated each other then the spell wouldn't break anyway.

It's still a great movie, just the characters are kinda unlikable if you dwell on it.

I just found myself really disliking Belle as I got older with her "poor provincial town" snobbery, lol. I mean guess what, Belle? People have to work for a living and they aren't idiots just because they don't have time to hear about your stupid book! Lol

At least the characters aren't plastic tropes like Pocahontas is. Which is sad, since Katzenberg (the same guy who almost ruined Toy Story) wanted a preachy Oscar Bait movie instead of a the wacky fun adventure they originally planned. A John Candy voiced Turkey. We lost something big there.

Oh yeah Beauty & the Beast is ten times better than Pocahontas which was just a PC bore fest, hehe.

 

[Drtooth]

but I really thought Disney would have been better than once again, planting the idea in peoples heads that fat people are lazy, eating machines that deserve to be made fun of :/

Eating didn't seem to be any much of the focus. Though I do tend to think they're not too far off with the everything being too convenient making everyone lazier and distracting them from anything else to the point of talking to people not face to face. Too bad their partnership with Apple kinda subverts that subversion. but then again, I'm saying this on a message board...so.... Sad thing is, Wall*e perfectly merges our two biggest problems (over reliance on computers/social media, libertarian views on corporations putting us in the very same corporate police state that they complain about the government doing) and gives us a very cynical view of the future. THAT'S why the film is powerful. And I really don't think the fat characters were half as offensive as say The Klumps, Norbit, or the guy who's name I can't say on this site from Austin Powers.

I'd say they're more complacent, if not brainwashed, consumers than gluttons. They completely obeyed every advertisement on the Axiom.

I just found myself really disliking Belle as I got older with her "poor provincial town" snobbery, lol. I mean guess what, Belle? People have to work for a living and they aren't idiots just because they don't have time to hear about your stupid book! Lol

Seems like a mutual distaste. Sometimes alienated people grow to loathe everyone else. So chicken and egg... maybe she wasn't a snob until the townsfolk snubbed her for reading books, maybe she snubbed the townsfolk first and just called her a snob and sang about her passive aggressively. Either way, both the townsfolk and Belle are jerks for being snobs to each other.

As far as Princesses go, my favorite Disney Princess is Mira Nova. She even has that "I want something more out of life than being royalty" schtick, but it is downplayed (unless they have an episode that features her on her home planet of Tangea) and she comes off a an awesome action chick with character flaws. But since she's part of a cartoon series spinoff, she apparently doesn't count OR exist . She didn't even get an action figure due to Mattel's very misogynistic views on girls in boy's action figure lines.

Oh yeah Beauty & the Beast is ten times better than Pocahontas which was just a PC bore fest, hehe.

The same guy who almost made Woody an insufferable nasty jerk who bullied the other toys and played it for laughs was the guy who said "let's make this weepy Oscar bait." Also the same brilliant mind behind Shark Tale. Thankfully he got better in his own studio.

I'd LOVE to see the original treatment with the talking turkey sidekick.

 

[CensoredAlso]

Seems like a mutual distaste. Sometimes alienated people grow to loathe everyone else. So chicken and egg... maybe she wasn't a snob until the townsfolk snubbed her for reading books, maybe she snubbed the townsfolk first and just called her a snob and sang about her passive aggressively. Either way, both the townsfolk and Belle are jerks for being snobs to each other.

Yeah don't you hate it when people sing about you behind your back? In harmony and everything, arghgh!

The same guy who almost made Woody an insufferable nasty jerk who bullied the other toys and played it for laughs was the guy who said "let's make this weepy Oscar bait." Also the same brilliant mind behind Shark Tale. Thankfully he got better in his own studio.

I'd LOVE to see the original treatment with the talking turkey sidekick.

If they had gone in that direction with Toy Story it would have been that much easier for the Henson Company to claim plagarism, lol.

And yeah even as a kid I thought it was odd that Pocahontas didn't have a goofy, talking sidekick.