Your Thoughts: When Everyone is Gone

MelissaY1

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Vic,
I'm very much like you. I really haven't cared for the most recent Muppet projects and I thought IAVMMC was awful. But you know, I go into all the new stuff trying to give it a chance too. I haven't collected any of the new DVDs, etc. but I give them a shot on T.V. But I'd much rather sit down and watch an episode of the Muppet Show I've seen 1000 times and was pleased as punch to see stuff like that Follow That Bird come to DVD. Maybe I'm stuck in a Muppet Time Warp, but I'm sorta happy that way :smile:
 

christyb

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Ok, so ya'll got me on one point. IAVMMC wasn't the greatest in the world. But c'mon. Ya'll haven't even given the Muppet Holding Co. and their team a chance. Wait and make your minds up after Oz. This may turn out to be as wonderful as you hoped it would be.
 

Cantus Rock

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christyb said:
Ok, so ya'll got me on one point. IAVMMC wasn't the greatest in the world. But c'mon. Ya'll haven't even given the Muppet Holding Co. and their team a chance. Wait and make your minds up after Oz. This may turn out to be as wonderful as you hoped it would be.
Kermit's Swamp Years nailed those hopes for yours truly. I mean I wasn't a huge MFS fan, but I liked it when I was younger. MCC is one of my all-time favs. Thus, you can see it; one by one the crew disappears, step by step the quality errodes.
 

Infinity Sirius

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I think the IVMMCM actually did very well to live up to the magic that Jim made. Sure, in some areas it wasn't that great, but overall it reflected something that I thought had long been missing. In KSY, it was a good story, but I think they were trying too hard to make the magic reappear.

I think the writers are trying too hard, and perhaps they just need to let things flow and let the Muppets be the Muppets.
 

Cantus Rock

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I agree with you on the IVMMCM point Infinity. But it does tie in with the lack of original performers.

Think of a cover of a Beatles song. Now, that could be an AMAZING cover. Seriously brilliant. But can it compare to the Beatles? No. Why? Because The Beatles were just that good. Same with the Muppets; all the current performers are masters, no doubt in my mind. But will they ever be the original troupe? No. Because Jim and Co. were just that good, and it can never be matched.

Thus, having the Muppets just flow won't be the same either. If you've ever seen an inpromptu Jim-as-Kermit, you'll know what I mean. It wasn't Jim performing a character, it was just Jim being Jim with a puppet. That, paired with the same flawless abilities of Frank, Jerry, Richard and Dave can never be recreated, no matter how good the writing is.

I'm not trying to be argumentative mind you, I just don't see any logical progression for the better here. And that is definitely upsetting. :frown:
 

christyb

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Cantus Rock said:
I agree with you on the IVMMCM point Infinity. But it does tie in with the lack of original performers.

Think of a cover of a Beatles song. Now, that could be an AMAZING cover. Seriously brilliant. But can it compare to the Beatles? No. Why? Because The Beatles were just that good. Same with the Muppets; all the current performers are masters, no doubt in my mind. But will they ever be the original troupe? No. Because Jim and Co. were just that good, and it can never be matched.

Thus, having the Muppets just flow won't be the same either. If you've ever seen an inpromptu Jim-as-Kermit, you'll know what I mean. It wasn't Jim performing a character, it was just Jim being Jim with a puppet. That, paired with the same flawless abilities of Frank, Jerry, Richard and Dave can never be recreated, no matter how good the writing is.

I'm not trying to be argumentative mind you, I just don't see any logical progression for the better here. And that is definitely upsetting. :frown:
Thank you. I completely agree with that. My only problem with VMMCM was the whole Club Dot scene but that's just personal preference. However, I don't think you can point at the new performers and blame that "Things aren't the same" on them. (or anyone else in that matter) Things changed drastically when Jerry Juhl left. He knew the Muppets like no one else could. The stories, jokes, and whatnot haven't been the same since. But like I've said before. Give things a chance before you make any rash judgements.
 

Beauregard

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christyb said:
Thank you. I completely agree with that. My only problem with VMMCM was the whole Club Dot scene but that's just personal preference. However, I don't think you can point at the new performers and blame that "Things aren't the same" on them. (or anyone else in that matter) Things changed drastically when Jerry Juhl left. He knew the Muppets like no one else could. The stories, jokes, and whatnot haven't been the same since. But like I've said before. Give things a chance before you make any rash judgements.
Absolutly. I don't see any place in VMC where it was the Muppet performers who caused the lowering of the Muppet-tone. This goes far beyond them. Fozzie acting stupidy outofcharacter at times? Was that Eric's fault? Not in the least.

Kermit throwing a strop and saying he wishes he was never born. Steve's fault? Hardly.
 

christyb

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Aye, they are just reading the scripts doing their job. My opinion is that (If I could) make the new writers sit down for a nice Muppet Marathon. I mean make them watch everything. Maybe then they can bring back some of what used to be. Ok I'm done ranting. I just get ticked when people blame the new performers who are trying their hardest. (And to you writers. Don't worry you'll learn. I'll defend you to the death too!) If we stick by the Muppets through better and worse things will turn out. Ok I'm seriously done preaching now.
 

Cantus Rock

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I don't blame anyone in peticular for the quality degradation of the characters. Like I said, these are the best puppeteers on earth. But no matter how good a performer one is, he's never going to be as good as the original when were talking about the Muppets. The only thing I blame them for is continuing this peddling of these half-whole pseudo-quality attractions involving the Muppets.

I don't even blame the writers, because I feel that Jim could take any script and turn it gold. Its no one's fault the "magic" is gone; its only their fault that they continue to stretch something that just isn't there anymore.
 

christyb

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Blame wasn't the exact word I was looking for. But that's what came out. I don't know actually how to describe what I was trying to say by that.
 
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