Your Thoughts: The Muppets' Wizard of Oz

[MWoO]

Well I hope I did not frighten you all off, i would love to discuss this some more.

You say you've studied the book. I was wondering if Gonzp's story fits with the book. Was the original Tin Man a man turned into a tin man by the withc as well?

 

[HPDJ]

Was the original Tin Man a man turned into a tin man by the witch as well?

Yes

 

[The Good Doctor]

Story of the Tin Man

The Tin Man, or Nick Chopper as he is often called lived in the forests of Munchkin Land, although he him self was no a Munchkin. He was a wood chopper by trade, and was very kind and loving to all things but especially the tress he often had to chop down.

Nick Chopper was in love with a beautiful Munchkin girl, but the girl lived with a wicked old woman. At this point it is often referenced that this old woman was The Wicked Witch of the East. But others say she was just wicked and knew some magic but went to the witch of the East for help. This old woman kept the Munchkin girl as her slave and did not want to loose her slave to the love of Nick Chopper.

So she had Nick Choppers Axe enchanted, and the next time he went to use it slipped from his hand and cut of his arm. Because nothing in The Land of Oz can be killer, Nick was not seriously hurt and went to his friend The Tin Smith who fashioned him with a new arm.....and the Munchkin girl still loved him. Enraged the woman had the axe enchanted again, and again Nick lost his other arm, and had it replaced with tin....and so it went on until he had 2 tin arms and 2 tin legs, but as long as Nick's heart was intact he still loved the Munchkin Girl, and she still loved him.

Furious the old woman had the axe enchanted one last time, and this time the axe slipped and severed Nick's head from his body. Then it chopped his body into tiny pieces and scattered them through the forest so they could never again be found. Nick lay on the ground and thought that was surely the end of him. But as luck would have it , his friend the Tin Smith happened by, found his limbs and head and took him home with him where he made a new tin body, and a new tin head for our friend Nick. But he forgot to give him a heart, so Nick chopper now the Tin Woodman soon for got all about his love, and carried on with his life as a happy wood chopper. If his Axe ever slipped again it never again could hurt him. And so he lived in the forest until one day he got caught in the rain with out his oil can, and rusted solid.

 

[MWoO]

Wow. Gonzo's story was similar, though I can see why they chose to leave out the whole chopping off of limbs part. I like the robot thing, as it is basically what the tin man was anyway.

I guess with all the back story behind the characters in the book it is pretty difficult to fit it all into a movie. I think a mini series would have done this project justice.

 

[The Good Doctor]

OZ mini series

Wow. Gonzo's story was similar, though I can see why they chose to leave out the whole chopping off of limbs part. I like the robot thing, as it is basically what the tin man was anyway.

I guess with all the back story behind the characters in the book it is pretty difficult to fit it all into a movie. I think a mini series would have done this project justice.

OZ mini series, I agree with that, although the DVD is supposed to have 20 minutes of added stuff, what I do not know, but perhaps they will include more tidbits of the original story.

As for the chopping off of the limbs, L. Frank Baum does a really good job of letting the reader know the true magic of the Land of Oz. It is kind of a hard concept to understand by watching the Muppet film, or even the MGM classic. But In the land of OZ, no one can truly be killed, but things and people can be destroyed, the Tin Man (or in this case Thing) and Scarecrow live, but are not alive, the do not need sleep, or to eat, they do not breather air which is why they do not fall asleep in the poppy field. The can not feel pain, but they know what pain is, and also what sadness is. Now once the Tin Man gets his heart, he truly can feel again, and in the same way once the scarecrow get his brains he can too feel the things that to be honest they have known and felt throughout the story, what they lack is physical representation of those things. Many times in Baum original book the tin man weeps out of sadness, and the scarecrow uses is head to save the day. But that is why when the Monkeys destroy them they are not dead, and really not even truly hurt.

How ever I do recognize it may have been a little to violent for young viewers, and I would hope that on the commercial break parents helped to put there children at ease. And reinforce the magical aspect of the story.

 

[Drtooth]

I know this is an old thread, though we should keep it going for those who will be seeing it on DVD for the first time, those who missed the broadcast.

Anyway, the one thing I DID like about it was that the "offensive" stuff was indeed a finger up at the self-righteous censorship movement that happened after Janet Jackson's boob was exposed on national TV.

I remember laughing at the innuendos and Scooter Cage dancing in VMX, after the whining about Snoop Dogg appearing in it.

But, frankly, I think that, even if they used the same script, if they made changes to the actual production, the end result could have been better. I mean, somewhere down the line, the overuse of Ashanti, who can sing, but can't act a lick, the crummy "campy Batman" style camera angles and cinematography, and the fact that the Muppets and Ashanti kind of seemed awkward with each other, when they were acting. Plus the art direction seemed a bit off.

The main thing I feel was wrong was that the movie was either too saccerine or too cryptic at times. I think thy could have at least made a couple script changes, a couple more drafts, before they started shooting. I still hate the ending, though.

 

[unclematt]

There is some great insight going on into the true meaning of the OZ stories. I would like to think that that much time and effort went into the Muppet version but I highly doubt it and I was even happy with the final result. I thought it was a great movie I just dont think that there was that much thought about the original book.

 

[The Good Doctor]

The Books/ The Film

There is some great insight going on into the true meaning of the OZ stories. I would like to think that that much time and effort went into the Muppet version but I highly doubt it and I was even happy with the final result. I thought it was a great movie I just dont think that there was that much thought about the original book.

I do not know if you have red the book, or if you intend to do so. As I have mentioned in the past I have collected and studied OZ for a number of years. And as many of you know I bad listed the Muppets OZ from the start.

Having seen the film, I really changed my point of view, and I realize that most every one here is making some really good observations and valid points about the fim and the Muppets in general..

Muppets OZ seems to do a lot of burrowing, and changing, which to be honest L. Frank Baum original OZ author did when he produced his OZ Silent films over 100 years ago. The hard part is taking such a magical story that dwells in out imagination, and placing it into what we all hope is a 3 dimensional reality. Some things just do not translate well from book to screen. Or require a Special Effects Budget similare to the Harry Potter Films. This Muppet version does fallow the book, and in truth they do a good job of it, but leave out a lot. The Muppets do a great job of getting getting the story mostly right.

If you are using the MGM Film Classic as a base for comparison, don't. In fact do not use any other film to date as a comparrison, except fot possibly The Wiz. Muppets Oz burrows a lot from the Rock and Roll film version with an all African American cast....The Wiz. The (Film) The Wiz itself while using a lot of great effects, falls short of the original stage story, (An underground Subway station with angry trash cans is a poor adaptation for the haunted forest with fighting trees), as well as the MGM Film. The Wiz transformed the Winged Monkeys into a motorcycle gang, and the Poppy Field into a dangerous night club. Which is silly when you think that in that film Dorothy wants to be a school teacher, not a rock star

Muppets OZ uses these 2 adaptations in a much better, understandable way. After all Dorothy wants to be a big star. And that the entertainment life is not always what it seems, it can be dangerous. Dorothy and her good friends band together to save the day. Which is a recurring theme through out the book, it takes team work.

(If you guys think I am talking to much, or just want me to shut up and give soem one else a chance please tell me. I feel like I am dominating the conversation, and do not intend to step on any toes here.)

Thank you.

 

[Beauregard]

Keep talking Good Doctor. As someone who has not seen the movie yet, your details are great to hear. And it's nice to hear somone defending it against the Book, not the retched MGM film...

 

[TogetherAgain]

Hear hear. (or is that "here here"? oh well)

I love hearing your opinion, Good Doctor. You know what you're talking about, and it shows. That's something I definately appreciate.