The Bible and Love and Christians

[Drtooth]

One thing that hasn't been mentioned in this thread, and i know he's a touchy person to discuss because many Christians don't favor this guy these days, but Pat Robertson recently endorsed divorce if a man's wife develops Alzheimer's. Talk about insensitive - not to mention creating a slippery slope of excuses to help deteriorate the sanctity of marriage. That's just horrible.

Pat Robertson is so westboro fringe to even the most fundie Christians, I'm not sure if he truly has any clout. I mean this is the guy who thinks God created the Haiti earthquake to punish them for voudou.

I'm glad that he's completely put his foot in his mouth enough times for him to lose his flock of sheep (biblical reference, not "mindless sheep" reference). There is nothing I hate more about religion than guys like Robertson. I've said what I need to say about those kinds of demons, and anything else would be redundant. It's all a money laundering/political intrigue scheme mascaraing as biblical excuses to hate people. And as I've said a million times before, THIS is the reason people unfairly hate Christians in this country.

What really sickens me is when they use disasters to say "Well, this is God punishing you for such and such." 9/11 was us not stoning gays to death and letting women wear pants, Hurricane Katrina was because of Mardis Gras or something, and Glenn Blecch blamed the horrifying disaster in Japan because they're Shintos and Buddhists and don't believe in the same thing as he does... you know, that stuff where qa guy found a secret book of the bible where people are cursed with black skin because they didn't fight in the space battle with space Jesus so everyone could have sex with the guy who found the books.

Oh man...yes. Where are these "Fiscal conservatives" with the black hole that is billions in "reconstruction" in Iraq and Afghanistan? Talk about a bridge to nowhere. But just like in the 2003 Freedom Fries/Dixie Chicks are traitor period, any debating war related costs is nil...again "gotta keep freedom free!" I personally don't think the public buys the terror thing anymore. They've played their hand, people have moved on.

Question: What issues do you think will be center stage in 2012 for the campaign?
I think Tooth is right in that the conservative think tanks manufacture Mccarthy era witchhunts and buzzwords to misdirect and fool a lot of people. The ultimate tricksters.
Like Van Jones, that is an amazing man who is dedicating his life to bringing true alternative energy and green jobs to both the middle class and inner city...and Glenn Beck turned him into some horrible person.

That era's why the country is divided, why everything went down the toilet so fast and why liberals REALLY hate Conservatives and the feeling is mutual. The oppression back then was ridiculous. We had you're with us or against us dirty politics controlling the nation, and now we've got "you're either with us or not... PLEASE BE MY FRIEND!!!" politics that further weakened the country.

Now I can't say the president is great or anything, but the sheer bile and childishness coming from the conservatives is cartoonish. I mean, as bad as some anti-Bush people behaved, they're the quiet children of strict parents compared to these guys. The completely not racist at all racist stuff, the illegal immigrant garbage, the Birther morons, the comparisons to Hitler (yeah... if Hitler were more like Obama, Poland would have invaded Germany... and someone explain to me how a watered down health care bill is ANYTHING like the mass execution of Jews). I mean, sure, there's the bailout that would have happened anyway with McCain in charge (who wants to lead us through that big of a disaster?), the fact that the stimulus proved that the only thing government can do is throw money at stuff and hope for the best (massive tax cuts for the wealthy are the same exact principle...0 Jobs in August?), and then this whole thing about throwing over 500 million at a company that went under (you mean government for the first time in [$5,000 dollar hammer] history can waste money [no bid contracts]). That's stuff's a valid complaint, sure...but all Obama did there was prove he's in government.

The fact of the matter is the Reps had an A plan and a B plan. McCain wins the election, they bail out the banks, pay Frank Lutz (the head of Satan's marketing firm) to call it Patriotic Geroge Washington Free Ice Cream... then they'd attack Iran and make everyone say "This is a good idea and don't question it." We'd still be in a bad, or WORSE place. Plan B, make Obama fail so we can get back in there and give even higher tax breaks for the rich that invest in other countries and buy the elections, and then attack Iran. So bad, they want to go to Iran.

 

[CensoredAlso]

And as I've said a million times before, THIS is the reason people unfairly hate Christians in this country.

That is probably true, but at the same time there's no excuse for stereotyping a whole group based on the actions of a few.

 

[beaker]

I heard about the 14 year old gay teen who contributed a video to the "It Gets Better" project committing suicide:

"People would just keep sending me hate, telling me that gay people go to ****," Jamey Rodemeyer said in that video, in which he also thanks Lady Gaga for her support for the gay community. "Just love yourself and you're set. And I promise you, it'll get better."
Jamey's mother, Tracy, said of the bullying her son received, "People would say, you're like a girl or whatever and then even some of them would say, 'What are you, gay?' And he did not like when he was being called those things."
Predictably, the abuse Jamey reportedly suffered wasn't just in school, but online as well. On Formspring, an Internet outlet that is popular among adolescents, and known for its verbally violent posts from anonymous users, Jamey received such messages as JAMIE IS STUPID, GAY, FAT ANND UGLY. HE MUST DIE!” and “I wouldn't care if you died. No one would. So just do it It would make everyone WAY more happier!”

http://digitallife.today.com/_news/...-to-it-gets-better-project-takes-his-own-life

This isn't a climate by Christians, but a climate of male ignorance and th ebelief by men of all walks of life that gay=less than a man.

Of course my beliefs are pretty far left. I tell my liberal friends celebrating the end of DADT to call me when Obama federally mandates gay marriage in all 50 states and stops dropping bombs on Muslims villages.
Sadly all the fundie right winger GOP stuff next year is going to drive a lot of liberals back in line with Obama, who is basically an Uncle Tom for the Wallstreet war machine banking cartel(IMHO)

The public should keep buying the terror thing; sadly it is very much real. They just shouldn't keep buying into the idea that the two party system is working.

Right....yeah lemme know when it's safe to come out of my bomb shelter...ya know, gotta be kept safe from al Kwayduhs and scary men from caves. Heck I think the jury is still out whetherMuslims were truly behind 9/11.
Hey, maybe one day we'll find out Saddam really did have Weapons of Mass destruction and ties to 9/11! :3

 

[beaker]

Tooth, you have to realize it's all scripted. Obama was engineered to win. The "right wing resistance" in the form of taking legitimate worries and concerns of heartland Americans(southern/midwestern/conservative/christians) and steam-valving it through GOP controlled "Tea Party committees" is all scripted. It's all part of the plan. You really think the powers that be intended for fuddy duddy Mccain and soccer mom Palin to win?
The majority of corporate and wallstreet money was hedged on Obama. Only he could get away with continuing the Bush neocon war and police state agenda. Only he could get away with the financial abuse. The liberals were pacified like an Afghan rug salesman on opium...only the lefties were high on "Hope"ium.

It's hilarious seeing liberals and right wingers duke it out, just like American soldiers and jihadis duking it out(ok, that's not so funny but just sad) both not realizing they're controlled and manipulated at the very top. It's a total top to bottom Hegelian dialectic. Now NOONE protests the war, even as Obama ramps up drone and army bases across Africa...you know, under the guise of "fighting them terruh-ists". (the very "Al Qaeda" and Sunni extremists controlled and paid for by the very rich globalists who are in bed with America)

Pat Robertson...he's the one who looks possessed. Guy looks like he's channeling Belezebub and throwing Illuminati Masonic gang signs on his 700 club.

Anyways it's just sad commenting on all this. We have pure horror and chaos in Mexico the media doesn't report, gay genocide all over Africa the media doesn't report, and just misery and death everywhere by the hands of these banksters, corporations and intelligence backed dictators.

Why doesn't Glenn Beck, Rush, Jon Stewart, Colbert, Hannity and all these other guys
left and righters worship advocate people DO something with their lives. Reach for dreams, help the needy, volunteer, start art therapy programs, become teachers, start community food coops, SOMETHING. Van Jones is aggressively trying to get alternative energy going and look at how Glenn Beck attacked him.

 

[CensoredAlso]

I'm done tolerating the attitude that "bullying is just part of growing up." Children need to be taught empathy for others and that they can't just just go around destroying other people. Thankfully suicide is a very rare side effect of bullying. But even a rare occasion is one too many. Plus some parents really do need to monitor their kids online more closely. If you have no idea your kid is typing "I wouldn't care if you died" on the Internet, there is something wrong there.

Heck I think the jury is still out whetherMuslims were truly behind 9/11.
Hey, maybe one day we'll find out Saddam really did have Weapons of Mass destruction and ties to 9/11! :3

Like I've said before, the world is complicated. Saddam obviously didn't have WMD or ties to 9/11. But were the 9/11 terrorists from al-Qaeda? Yes they were. They were angry at the US' international actions in the past (we did make a lot of mistakes). But they also just hated anyone who didn't think like them. And tolerance didn't do it for them; only destruction.

Most conspiracy theories assume the world is more interesting than it actually is.

 

[beaker]

Most conspiracy theories assume the world is more interesting than it actually is.

Right, "conspiracy theories". I've been studying history and foreign policy since the early 1990's.

Why is it people who believe in invisible fairy men in the sky and horned deviled characters find people's political views to be "conspiracy"...I just encounter this a lot.

Sorry, I don't believe for a second some men from a cave brought down those three highrises alone. Then again I realized at an early age there was no Santa or Easter Bunny.

But ok, sure there's Islamist jihadi whatever terrorists. But uh, what do we call it when hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians are killed/maimed as the direct result of America's two main wars of the last decade? To the villagers being killed, it doesnt matter if its American bombs, NATO bombs, Israeli bombs, or Islamist militants.

 

[beaker]

I'm done tolerating the attitude that "bullying is just part of growing up." Children need to be taught empathy for others and that they can't just just go around destroying other people. Thankfully suicide is a very rare side effect of bullying. But even a rare occasion is one too many. Plus some parents really do need to monitor their kids online more closely. If you have no idea your kid is typing "I wouldn't care if you died" on the Internet, there is something wrong there.

Couldn't agree more. I've seen it so pervasive. Minority kid in an all white school. White kid in an all black school. Slightly effeminete kid being bullied from all directions. Kids have no clue how deeply their bullying hurts and cuts deep. Even if it doesn't end in suicide, it manifests in other ways....stomach issues, eating disorders, etc. Im glad theres a new focus and awareness on bullying. Bullying is bull, and noone should put up with it.

 

[RedPiggy]

Sorry, I don't believe for a second some men from a cave brought down those three highrises alone. Then again I realized at an early age there was no Santa or Easter Bunny.

This wasn't exactly Osama's Nineteen, beaker. It was only "clever" in that our country was too lazy to deal with the problem. The WTC wasn't the Fortress of Solitude (and you can even blow THAT up). They were skyscrapers. Skyscrapers can fall down. Just because some architects said only God could tear it down doesn't mean men can't. (In fact, I blame THAT statement for the fall ... didn't they read the Tower of Babel or watch Titanic? You DON'T go telling God what He can and cannot knock over.) You can't punch a big gaping hole in a building and have it still stand up. They weren't DESIGNED to have big gaping holes in them. Like a Jenga tower, they knocked out required supports and down they went. I think all the "it was impossible for planes to knock down the buildings" is code for "I can't let people know I was being an egotistical engineer who can't admit I didn't build a ******* fortress, just a couple of tall office buildings."

 

[Drtooth]

Why doesn't Glenn Beck, Rush, Jon Stewart, Colbert, Hannity and all these other guys
left and righters worship advocate people DO something with their lives. Reach for dreams, help the needy, volunteer, start art therapy programs, become teachers, start community food coops, SOMETHING. Van Jones is aggressively trying to get alternative energy going and look at how Glenn Beck attacked him.

Unlike the others, at least Stewart and Colbert are going to these stupid countries where we have these stupid wars and talking to the soldiers while Geck and the rest are sitting pretty in their expensive homes funded by their right wing gobbledy gook books and TV shows that make them millionaires. Didn't Colbert, in character, testify before congress about the nation's screwed up farming system?

I understand what you're getting at, but there's a difference. Stewart and Colbert were designed as comedy shows. I give them credit for taking the worst situations we've had the past decade, even Obama stuff, and making them funny and not so terrible. Unlike Beck and the rest, they aren't beasts that feed off of hatred. Heck, Stewart's exactly what I think the middle ground should be politically. He's been hacking on the president a LOT lately, and does so on the issues and his pathetic klutziness instead of imaginary conspiracy theories about birth certificates and socialism.

Again, I watch him purely as a comedian, not an opinion.

 

[CensoredAlso]

Why is it people who believe in invisible fairy men in the sky and horned deviled characters find people's political views to be "conspiracy"...I just encounter this a lot.

Religion is about faith and doesn't claim to be about facts. Conspiracy theories are about theories masquerading as facts. I'm not trying to be rude, honestly, but you asked.

Plus a political view is more like, "I think the taxes should be raised." But to say "I think the US did 9/11" is not a viewpoint. It's either true or not true.

But ok, sure there's Islamist jihadi whatever terrorists. But uh, what do we call it when hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians are killed/maimed as the direct result of America's two main wars of the last decade? To the villagers being killed, it doesnt matter if its American bombs, NATO bombs, Israeli bombs, or Islamist militants.

I've already said several times that the US has been at fault as well, including before 9/11. Doesn't mean there haven't also been terrorist attacks on the US. In fact it makes sense that there was, considering our foreign policy (not that we "deserved" it. Just saying it makes sense that there would be repercussions).

Again, just because we have been wrong, doesn't make the other side right. Life is more complicated than that. Sometimes both sides are wrong. And yes as RedPiggy said, it's not that surprising that the buildings were brought down so easily, from a structural standpoint.