Muppets Most Wanted: What went wrong?

[Ladywarrior]

oh boy. I'm gonna tear into this film so badly.
First The Muppets from 2011 I enjoyed I think mostly because it was written BY the fans FOR the fans. I believe Muppets Most Wanted was not. Now that that is out of the way.
I HATED this film. I have in my time not enjoyed some of the muppet films before. THIS one makes THOSE films look like masterpieces in comparison. It feels like they took whatever good qualities the muppets had and threw them out the window.
First of all they made the characters extremely selfish and well very full of themselves. They got back together after a long time, yes but let me just say this. Remember the moopets from the 2011 film? Remember how that evil dude who can't laugh said nobody likes good and wholesome characters in this day and age? The muppets were shocked and appalled about this at the time. Sadly in Most Wanted they seem to have sold out and became JUST like the Moopets in their attitudes and behavior. I noticed this when I watched the movie and it frankly disgusted me. I mean they wanted to be family friendly and a great influence to everyone to prove good and wholesome can STILL be relevant in this time. so WHY the sudden heal face turn of characterization?
Second HOW did the Muppets NOT realize that constantine WASN'T kermit? The whole "he's got a cold" excuse is just crap. His mannerisms and speech were a dead give away and MAYBE MAYBE I can give them a little slack at the beginning but it seems like they traveled around for awhile. These muppets have been together a long time. They KNEW kermit for a long time. They know how he is. SOMEBODY would have become suspicious after awhile. and please don't give me that "they are poking fun at the trope" excuse. That's no excuse for making ALL the muppets except for Animal so dumb! Especially ones like Gonzo and Fozzy and MISS PIGGY! She's in love with kermit if anyone would notice a change it would be her. But she seems to have been reduced to a shell of her former self. Yes she has her moments but they are few and far between
Third there's the basic premise of the film. The entire tone is mean spirited and the entire message seems to be "The Muppets aren't relevant anymore and NOBODY cARES ABOUT THEM". Let me just point out I grew up watching Muppet films. The very first one I remember watching was Muppet Christmas Carol. I have enjoyed them all my life even if I don't like some of them. Walter and his brother even have the DVDs in their house. Obviously the movies are canon in that universe and the opening song in most wanted even mentions how many films they've made but I'm getting off topic here.. Anyway as the film goes on walter follows the villain to this place where he pays off some reporters. The guy makes an off handed comment on how NOBODY would WANT to watch the Muppets willingly and he even told them to pay people to take the tickets. This seems to imply NOT ONE SINGLE person in the entire country they go to would want to see the muppets perform UNLESS THEY ARE PAID TO SEE THEM. Does this mean the only person on the planet who is a fan of the muppets is walter? I mean they visit quite a few countries NONE of those countries have fans? Why do the producers of the film have to go this far with that irelevent muppets message? Doesn't disney think the muppets matter even though THEY BOUGHT the rights to them?
All in all I thought the characterization of the Muppets was poorly done, the plot was thin as a sheet of tracing paper, and the basic message of hem movie was insulting. Also let's not forget by the end of the film the Muppets have not regained their fame and recognition. They are still basically nobodies.
So to sum up the film in one word: Depressing.

 

[Dominicboo1]

oh boy. I'm gonna tear into this film so badly.
First The Muppets from 2011 I enjoyed I think mostly because it was written BY the fans FOR the fans. I believe Muppets Most Wanted was not. Now that that is out of the way.
I HATED this film. I have in my time not enjoyed some of the muppet films before. THIS one makes THOSE films look like masterpieces in comparison. It feels like they took whatever good qualities the muppets had and threw them out the window.
First of all they made the characters extremely selfish and well very full of themselves. They got back together after a long time, yes but let me just say this. Remember the moopets from the 2011 film? Remember how that evil dude who can't laugh said nobody likes good and wholesome characters in this day and age? The muppets were shocked and appalled about this at the time. Sadly in Most Wanted they seem to have sold out and became JUST like the Moopets in their attitudes and behavior. I noticed this when I watched the movie and it frankly disgusted me. I mean they wanted to be family friendly and a great influence to everyone to prove good and wholesome can STILL be relevant in this time. so WHY the sudden heal face turn of characterization?
Second HOW did the Muppets NOT realize that constantine WASN'T kermit? The whole "he's got a cold" excuse is just crap. His mannerisms and speech were a dead give away and MAYBE MAYBE I can give them a little slack at the beginning but it seems like they traveled around for awhile. These muppets have been together a long time. They KNEW kermit for a long time. They know how he is. SOMEBODY would have become suspicious after awhile. and please don't give me that "they are poking fun at the trope" excuse. That's no excuse for making ALL the muppets except for Animal so dumb! Especially ones like Gonzo and Fozzy and MISS PIGGY! She's in love with kermit if anyone would notice a change it would be her. But she seems to have been reduced to a shell of her former self. Yes she has her moments but they are few and far between
Third there's the basic premise of the film. The entire tone is mean spirited and the entire message seems to be "The Muppets aren't relevant anymore and NOBODY cARES ABOUT THEM". Let me just point out I grew up watching Muppet films. The very first one I remember watching was Muppet Christmas Carol. I have enjoyed them all my life even if I don't like some of them. Walter and his brother even have the DVDs in their house. Obviously the movies are canon in that universe and the opening song in most wanted even mentions how many films they've made but I'm getting off topic here.. Anyway as the film goes on walter follows the villain to this place where he pays off some reporters. The guy makes an off handed comment on how NOBODY would WANT to watch the Muppets willingly and he even told them to pay people to take the tickets. This seems to imply NOT ONE SINGLE person in the entire country they go to would want to see the muppets perform UNLESS THEY ARE PAID TO SEE THEM. Does this mean the only person on the planet who is a fan of the muppets is walter? I mean they visit quite a few countries NONE of those countries have fans? Why do the producers of the film have to go this far with that irelevent muppets message? Doesn't disney think the muppets matter even though THEY BOUGHT the rights to them?
All in all I thought the characterization of the Muppets was poorly done, the plot was thin as a sheet of tracing paper, and the basic message of hem movie was insulting. Also let's not forget by the end of the film the Muppets have not regained their fame and recognition. They are still basically nobodies.
So to sum up the film in one word: Depressing.

Ok one thing. The Muppets always have mocked themselves. Starlet and Waldorf? Sam the Eagle? Their whole point is to mock or call the Muppets weird. The show had to GIVE away tickets to get people to stay.The show was a joke. In one episode Gladys thinks Kermit is crazy for suggesting she charge a sandwich to the show. So Muppets Most Wanted is far from the first time the Muppets did this.

 

[CensoredAlso]

Ok one thing. The Muppets always have mocked themselves.

There's a difference between laughing with the Muppets, and just laughing at them. MMW crossed that line for me.

 

[Ladywarrior]

There's a difference between laughing with the Muppets, and just laughing at them. MMW crossed that line for me.

my point exactly!

 

[Dominicboo1]

There's a difference between laughing with the Muppets, and just laughing at them. MMW crossed that line for me.

Oh I see. You mean it's different if a human says it!

 

[dwayne1115]

oh boy. I'm gonna tear into this film so badly.
First The Muppets from 2011 I enjoyed I think mostly because it was written BY the fans FOR the fans. I believe Muppets Most Wanted was not. Now that that is out of the way.
I HATED this film. I have in my time not enjoyed some of the muppet films before. THIS one makes THOSE films look like masterpieces in comparison. It feels like they took whatever good qualities the muppets had and threw them out the window.
First of all they made the characters extremely selfish and well very full of themselves. They got back together after a long time, yes but let me just say this. Remember the moopets from the 2011 film? Remember how that evil dude who can't laugh said nobody likes good and wholesome characters in this day and age? The muppets were shocked and appalled about this at the time. Sadly in Most Wanted they seem to have sold out and became JUST like the Moopets in their attitudes and behavior. I noticed this when I watched the movie and it frankly disgusted me. I mean they wanted to be family friendly and a great influence to everyone to prove good and wholesome can STILL be relevant in this time. so WHY the sudden heal face turn of characterization?
Second HOW did the Muppets NOT realize that constantine WASN'T kermit? The whole "he's got a cold" excuse is just crap. His mannerisms and speech were a dead give away and MAYBE MAYBE I can give them a little slack at the beginning but it seems like they traveled around for awhile. These muppets have been together a long time. They KNEW kermit for a long time. They know how he is. SOMEBODY would have become suspicious after awhile. and please don't give me that "they are poking fun at the trope" excuse. That's no excuse for making ALL the muppets except for Animal so dumb! Especially ones like Gonzo and Fozzy and MISS PIGGY! She's in love with kermit if anyone would notice a change it would be her. But she seems to have been reduced to a shell of her former self. Yes she has her moments but they are few and far between
Third there's the basic premise of the film. The entire tone is mean spirited and the entire message seems to be "The Muppets aren't relevant anymore and NOBODY cARES ABOUT THEM". Let me just point out I grew up watching Muppet films. The very first one I remember watching was Muppet Christmas Carol. I have enjoyed them all my life even if I don't like some of them. Walter and his brother even have the DVDs in their house. Obviously the movies are canon in that universe and the opening song in most wanted even mentions how many films they've made but I'm getting off topic here.. Anyway as the film goes on walter follows the villain to this place where he pays off some reporters. The guy makes an off handed comment on how NOBODY would WANT to watch the Muppets willingly and he even told them to pay people to take the tickets. This seems to imply NOT ONE SINGLE person in the entire country they go to would want to see the muppets perform UNLESS THEY ARE PAID TO SEE THEM. Does this mean the only person on the planet who is a fan of the muppets is walter? I mean they visit quite a few countries NONE of those countries have fans? Why do the producers of the film have to go this far with that irelevent muppets message? Doesn't disney think the muppets matter even though THEY BOUGHT the rights to them?
All in all I thought the characterization of the Muppets was poorly done, the plot was thin as a sheet of tracing paper, and the basic message of hem movie was insulting. Also let's not forget by the end of the film the Muppets have not regained their fame and recognition. They are still basically nobodies.
So to sum up the film in one word: Depressing.

It's all about the pig....Piggy should have realized something was wrong with Kermit from the very beginning. The frog and the pig love each other, in different ways but they love each other. For her and Fozzie to not notice from the get go that something was wrong still gets me. For them to both be kind of clueless throughout just didn't work for me.
Now that being said I love Animal in Most Wanted, but I also found it troubling how the writers thought that the most wildest and craziest member of the Muppets would know something is wrong. For me the movie had it's good points, I thought Gonzo was well written for, and I love Rizzo and Robin's cameo.

 

[Dominicboo1]

It's all about the pig....Piggy should have realized something was wrong with Kermit from the very beginning. The frog and the pig love each other, in different ways but they love each other. For her and Fozzie to not notice from the get go that something was wrong still gets me. For them to both be kind of clueless throughout just didn't work for me.
Now that being said I love Animal in Most Wanted, but I also found it troubling how the writers thought that the most wildest and craziest member of the Muppets would know something is wrong. For me the movie had it's good points, I thought Gonzo was well written for, and I love Rizzo and Robin's cameo.

Well Animal could tell by smell. It's like in the original Parent Trap where only a dog realizes when twins switch places

 

[Ladywarrior]

makes me wish THIS had happened.

 

[jvcarroll]

There's a difference between laughing with the Muppets, and just laughing at them. MMW crossed that line for me.

I'd claim to feel the complete opposite, but that assessment is grossly inaccurate of the Muppets. Yes, sometimes they are laughed both at and with in classic Muppet media. Their charm is one of anarchic innocence.

TM uses the Muppets as foils far more than MMW does. MMW is the closest to the classic Muppet dynamic.

I do not understand this false filter employed by some fans. While I appreciate what TM did for the brand, I never want to see the gang that lobotomized again. It was a good little film where the Muppets took a back seat for most of the ride and their personalities did too.

TM seems like what happens when the Muppets read the lines given to them by a screenwriter. MMW seems like what they are when they're in between takes. That's the real magic. The only significant issue with MMW was that it favored boring plot elements when it should have cranked-up the zany spectacle. That's where the movie really shines.

 

[CensoredAlso]

While I appreciate what TM did for the brand, I never want to see the gang that lobotomized again.

Well what makes you think I'm comparing MMW to TM? I honestly haven't watched either film since the theatre. When I compare a new Muppets movie, it's generally to the original three. Is that fair?....Nope!*


*(Red Letter Media reference)