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If Jim hadn't died in 1990

wemblingalong

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I think Jim was ready to move on to other things. Just like in a career, you don't want to stick to the same thing you want to try new things (well at least you SHOULD want to). Jim was gong towards more complex projects towards the end of his life. The conceptual work of Dinosaurs, the Storyteller, Jim Henson Hour, and Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles were all examples of his change in direction within the muppet universe. Do I think Kermit would still be making cameos and a special here or there, yes. I guess we'll never really know. :confused:
 

GuySmileyfan

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If Jim hadn't died in the first place, the new Guy Smiley episodes should of go on.
 

frogboy4

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Humm so are you saying that you think Jim have have been startig to think the Muppets where holding him back? I don't know about all that.
I think Jim was annoyed of only being associated with the Muppets. It caused him grief when the studio didn't like the Dark Crystal because they felt it was going to be a comedic Muppet fantasy picture or something. The Muppets were only one of the colors in his complete palette of creations. It isn't that they were holding him back necessarily. It just appeared all that studios would fund. In his mind the Disney sale solved that problem for him. He kept wanting to do new things, but didn't feel the need to abandon classic creations to do so. At least that's how I see it. :smile:
 

dwayne1115

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I think Jim was annoyed of only being associated with the Muppets. It caused him grief when the studio didn't like the Dark Crystal because they felt it was going to be a comedic Muppet fantasy picture or something. The Muppets were only one of the colors in his complete palette of creations. It isn't that they were holding him back necessarily. It just appeared all that studios would fund. In his mind the Disney sale solved that problem for him. He kept wanting to do new things, but didn't feel the need to abandon classic creations to do so. At least that's how I see it. :smile:
Well if you really look at it that way, then thats how Frank has done as well.
 

frogboy4

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Well if you really look at it that way, then thats how Frank has done as well.
Frank did pretty much abandon his Muppet past for a future in directing. There's nothing wrong with that, of course. Oz gave so much to the Muppets over many years, but that's not at all what the body of my post reflected about Jim Henson: "[Jim] kept wanting to do new things, but didn't feel the need to abandon classic creations to do so." Hope that clears it up, because I don't feel at all that what Frank has done is in line with what Jim would have. Not at all. :concern:
 

dwayne1115

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Frank did pretty much abandon his Muppet past for a future in directing. There's nothing wrong with that, of course. Oz gave so much to the Muppets over many years, but that's not at all what the body of my post reflected about Jim Henson: "[Jim] kept wanting to do new things, but didn't feel the need to abandon classic creations to do so." Hope that clears it up, because I don't feel at all that what Frank has done is in line with what Jim would have. Not at all. :concern:
I understand now. I think though it is kind of like that the Muppets where really what the world saw Jim as. Yes Jim was much more and if still alive today would hopfully been able to do more outside the Muppets I just don't know if many people would like the things he did. I think it brings up the question which are you a Henson fan or a Muppet fan. Because not everything Henson did was with the Muppets.
 

dwayne1115

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A thought

The Muppets where really what gave Jim Henson, and Frank Oz for that matter there stardom and success. Jim and Frank however where really the ones who made not only the Muppets but themselfs succsessful. When most people hear the name Muppets they think of the names Henson and Oz. When people here the names Henson and Oz they think of Muppets. Jim would have had to known that to try and branch out with a movie at a time when the Muppets where so huge would have not been the best way to go. People would think it was just another Muppet movie. I'm not saying Jim should not have done the Dark Crystal or Laberath I think he should have let somone else take his ideas and run with them.
 

frogboy4

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I understand now. I think though it is kind of like that the Muppets where really what the world saw Jim as. Yes Jim was much more and if still alive today would hopfully been able to do more outside the Muppets I just don't know if many people would like the things he did. I think it brings up the question which are you a Henson fan or a Muppet fan. Because not everything Henson did was with the Muppets.
I have to admit, I'm a Muppet fan first. The Muppet Show characters in particular have always meant so much to me. This is followed by Fraggle Rock, the fantasy film projects and Sesame Street of course. So I am a big fan of the world of Jim Henson, yet his Muppet gang has a remarkably special place in my heart.

There’s just something about the gang that sort of bridges much of his worlds together. I see them really as the center. The characters, for the most part, are adults themselves therefore aren’t too naïve. Yeah, Fozzie can have a great deal of innocence to him at times. They are also more tangible and relatable than the fantasy characters.

Fraggle Rock comes in second to me because I didn’t get to watch it regularly. What a beautiful world the Henson team created. It’s a stunning quality show that today’s networks are too cheap to attempt. HBO really never knew what they had with the Fraggles.

I think Jim would have brought the Fraggles back for something. He would have likely explored the Fraggle themes in other projects. He also would have continued his environmental PSAs and possibly created a project specifically about the environment geared towards young people.
 

dwayne1115

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I have to admit, I'm a Muppet fan first. The Muppet Show characters in particular have always meant so much to me. This is followed by Fraggle Rock, the fantasy film projects and Sesame Street of course. So I am a big fan of the world of Jim Henson, yet his Muppet gang has a remarkably special place in my heart.

There’s just something about the gang that sort of bridges much of his worlds together. I see them really as the center. The characters, for the most part, are adults themselves therefore aren’t too naïve. Yeah, Fozzie can have a great deal of innocence to him at times. They are also more tangible and relatable than the fantasy characters.

Fraggle Rock comes in second to me because I didn’t get to watch it regularly. What a beautiful world the Henson team created. It’s a stunning quality show that today’s networks are too cheap to attempt. HBO really never knew what they had with the Fraggles.

I think Jim would have brought the Fraggles back for something. He would have likely explored the Fraggle themes in other projects. He also would have continued his environmental PSAs and possibly created a project specifically about the environment geared towards young people.

I think generaly that is how most people feel about Jim and the Muppets I think some fans felt like with the fantisy filmes that because it is from Jim Henson you should also like the movies. I have both DVD's Watched both and really I feel there is something misssing. Now the puppetry in both movies is outstanding, but I feel there is just something missing in both movies.
 

frogboy4

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I think generaly that is how most people feel about Jim and the Muppets I think some fans felt like with the fantisy filmes that because it is from Jim Henson you should also like the movies. I have both DVD's Watched both and really I feel there is something misssing. Now the puppetry in both movies is outstanding, but I feel there is just something missing in both movies.
I think a sense of jeopardy is missing from the "Labyrinth" plot, but I personally consider "The Dark Crystal" as Jim's best film. However a lot of people felt conflicted about “Dark Crystal” and felt it needed to be Muppety. I like that it wasn’t. I don’t think there’d be a sequel to this if Jim were around.
 
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