Bert and Ernie Gay Rumor: Settled

[beaker]

For 's sake Muppets are not gay. JUST like Ernie & Bert are not gay. OK?

you sure about that? 6:22
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a0puzAX_J74&feature=player_detailpage#t=388s

folks would be surprised to know how many of the main people behind the Muppet Show were in fact gay(Richard Hunt, Kermit Love, etc) I mean it's a singing, dancing musical show bursting with color...it's a very gay friendly show, as its friendly to all people

That Said, I am COMPLETELY against any pairings of underage Sesame or Muppet characters. Aren't Bert and Ernie supposed to be underage? I just can't see Elmo and Abby together or anything like that.

It's bad enough the Count is a total womanizing player

 

[beaker]

Wow! While I respect your point of view on the topic, the passion in your reply appears to expose some rather angry feelings toward gay people. I hope that's not the case. Many entertainment properties, including the Muppets, would be much different without creative folk from all walks of life including gay people.

As i've stated before, this is very much a litmus test for tolerance. It reminds me of a few dissenters who were upset with the possibility of Zoot being Jewish.

I do think this petition is as silly as the people who get so riled up against it. Who the heck cares is Bert & Ernie display some gay tendencies? Rest assured that nothing is going to change on Sesame Street.

You can't be serious. Are you serious? People were upset that Zoot is Jewish? As long as they don't make Crazy Harry Muslim, I say it's ok for Muppets to be of any gender, creed, religion, orientation, etc. People even get upset when I say there are black Muppets, as if it's "crazy" to think Clifford, Rosevelt Franklin, Hoots, etc are representational of different walks of African Americans JUST like Statler, Waldorf, Piggy, Scooter, JP Grosse, etc are suppose to be white people.

 

[frogboy4]

You can't be serious. Are you serious? People were upset that Zoot is Jewish? As long as they don't make Crazy Harry Muslim, I say it's ok for Muppets to be of any gender, creed, religion, orientation, etc. People even get upset when I say there are black Muppets, as if it's "crazy" to think Clifford, Rosevelt Franklin, Hoots, etc are representational of different walks of African Americans JUST like Statler, Waldorf, Piggy, Scooter, JP Grosse, etc are suppose to be white people.

Hey, Scooter is orange!

Yeah, i get what you mean. i just remember people being freaked out by his "Shalom" line in LTS. I loved that was his one line!

 

[Drtooth]

That Said, I am COMPLETELY against any pairings of underage Sesame or Muppet characters. Aren't Bert and Ernie supposed to be underage? I just can't see Elmo and Abby together or anything like that.

Elmo and Zoe are SOOOO going to be something when they're older. That's just how I see it. Elmo and Abby get along like they're friends of friends that just happen to be alone together when someone leaves to tend to a work emergency or something. It's not so much a paring, but a possible growing of more than friends in time... like when they're teenagers they realize there's been a spark since childhood. Hypothetically speaking of course.

Yeah, the underage thing is the only way I don't see the Ernie/Bert connection working. Ernie did state, himself, that he was 6 (but that was in a video tape, so it's not common knowledge).

Now, Link Hogthrob is a special kind of gay. He is clearly in absolute head over heals love for a man... but of course, it is himself.

People were upset that Zoot is Jewish? As long as they don't make Crazy Harry Muslim, I say it's ok for Muppets to be of any gender, creed, religion, orientation, etc. People even get upset when I say there are black Muppets, as if it's "crazy" to think Clifford, Rosevelt Franklin, Hoots, etc are representational of different walks of African Americans JUST like Statler, Waldorf, Piggy, Scooter, JP Grosse, etc are suppose to be white people.

By that case... is it wrong to think that any character puppeteered by someone of a certain race is that race? I always felt that Elmo was black, too. Of course, I completely think Hong Kong Phooey is black due to the fact that Scatman Crothers did his voice, yet Cree Summer always winds up doing the voice of white girls (Elmyra in Tiny Toons, Penny... the BEST Penny in Inspector Gadget).

I consider Scooter a human EVERY much as I consider all the Electric Mayhem human (even Animal... at least a wild, feral human being) even though they're noseless or green or whatever...I kinda consider Clifford the weird middle between human and creature.

 

[Slackbot]

Sigh. It's kind of sad that this is even an issue, IMO. What bothers me most--after the obvious "No gay Muppets! Protect the children!" attitude--is the idea that two people who are very, very close just have to be romantically involved. There are relationships that are nonsexual out there, and B&E's is one. I agree with those who have said that showing two people of the same sex in a close, caring relationship is a good thing, period.

I'd love to see a gay or lesbian couple explained on SS as two men or women who love each other. No big fanfare, just show that it's a normal, acceptable thing, nothing to get wound up about. Unfortunately, that would he "indooctrinating the children" with "the homosexual agenda."

 

[CensoredAlso]

What bothers me most--after the obvious "No gay Muppets! Protect the children!" attitude--is the idea that two people who are very, very close just have to be romantically involved. There are relationships that are nonsexual out there, and B&E's is one. I agree with those who have said that showing two people of the same sex in a close, caring relationship is a good thing, period.

Exactly, what are we trying to say, that two male characters who are friends must always keep their distance from each other, lest someone think they're a couple? Like I said earlier, it's the old stereotype that men can't show their feelings.

 

[Drtooth]

I'd love to see a gay or lesbian couple explained on SS as two men or women who love each other. No big fanfare, just show that it's a normal, acceptable thing, nothing to get wound up about. Unfortunately, that would he "indooctrinating the children" with "the homosexual agenda."

I could get on a whole big thing about that, but it is a touchy subject. On the one hand, it is for parents to discuss... but then again, parents can pass down their prejudices and agendas, thus stifling any change and kids leading on to think outside of what they're forced to believe. Things always need to be questioned, or we'd never go forward... socially OR technologically. That said, no one has a problem with certain media outlets and their indoctrinating their viewers with their agendas....

I don't have a problem with any characters being gay or non-white Christians... not every Muppeteer is straight, white, or Christian. Yet, I find it some sort of genetic male homophobia when anyone questions a close friendship between two people as being gay. You could probably say the same stuff about Snuffy and Big Bird or Statler and Waldorf (even though Waldorf is married.... to someone who looks EXACTLY like Statler...hmmmmm). I like the progress of "Bromance" and "Bromantic relationships." At least that says 2 guys can be close to each other and not automatically be gay.

I don't find accusations of Ernie and Bert offensive by any means... it just seems incorrect.

 

[CensoredAlso]

On the one hand, it is for parents to discuss... but then again, parents can pass down their prejudices and agendas, thus stifling any change and kids leading on to think outside of what they're forced to believe.

But did you go along with everything your parents ever told you? At some point everyone decides for themselves.

Yet, I find it some sort of genetic male homophobia when anyone questions a close friendship between two people as being gay. You could probably say the same stuff about Snuffy and Big Bird or Statler and Waldorf (even though Waldorf is married.... to someone who looks EXACTLY like Statler...hmmmmm). I like the progress of "Bromance" and "Bromantic relationships." At least that says 2 guys can be close to each other and not automatically be gay.

Exactly, it's one thing to speculate that characters could be gay because it would make a new and interesting storyline. It's another when you assume they must be gay because "real men don't hug."

 

[Drtooth]

But did you go along with everything your parents ever told you? At some point everyone decides for themselves.

Uh... I'd go to a pretty dark place if I said anything about that. Let's just say they taught me the REAL good values, and somehow the real world goes by its own illogic.

Exactly, it's one thing to speculate that characters could be gay because it would make a new and interesting storyline. It's another when you assume they must be because "real men don't hug."

The sad thing is, when Entourage came up with "Hug it out, [word I can't say here]" that was a total leap forward for males. At least in the US... we are a pretty anal retentive society when it comes to that stuff.

 

[CensoredAlso]

The sad thing is, when Entourage came up with "Hug it out, [word I can't say here]" that was a total leap forward for males. At least in the US... we are a pretty anal retentive society when it comes to that stuff.

Right, so I think that's where some people are coming from with the whole Bert & Ernie thing. They don't like the knee jerk reaction "they must be gay because they hugged" kind of thing. Not that they're anti homosexuality.

Some people are of course. But I'm just saying there's a lot of different perspectives here.