Seven Years Later: Disney buys Muppets and Bear

[CensoredAlso]

And now that I just used a Pepe icon, it reminds me that I'm surprised to hear Pepe won't be in the new film much, because if anyone is going to be "edgy" it should be him. I like Pepe, by the way.

Not saying Pepe shouldn't be in the movie, but it's not like the Muppets were never edgy before he entered the picture.

 

[frogboy4]

I just don't get the Disney negativity. Their 7 years of Muppet ownership hasn't been 100% successful so far, but they've gone above and beyond the days of Henson and ETV ownership that preceded the Disney buyout. Sometimes fans have short and convenient memories.

The kiddified Kermit's Swamp Years was before Disney. The cinematic mess of Muppets From Space that killed the Muppets career in films for over a decade was before Disney. The very odd French Muppet Show was before Disney. The many broken promises of a new primetime Muppet Show was before Disney.

Actually, some of the most memorable post-Jim Muppet projects not under Disney ownership occurred under Disney partnership like the Muppet Christmas Carol, Muppet Treasure Island and Muppets Tonight (that was canceled way too early, yet shot 22 episodes - nearly twice as much as the Henson Hour had before its cancellation).

We've been griping about season 4 Muppet Show on DVD, but hey...Disney is the company that brought us seasons 1-3 on DVD - something nobody had ever brought to viewers in all the years of the home video market. Is Disney perfect? Of course not. Do they care more about cash than sentiment? Of course they do, yet they've also learned that profits soar when both can go hand-in-hand.

We've also gotten all-new books and fantastic web media that calls back to the day of the Muppet Show! Muppets.com under Henson and ETV was a terrible mismanaged experiment that was continually abandoned.

I love the Henson Company, but after Jim the Muppets proved to be too big for them to handle properly. Let's not forget that this is exactly where Jim wanted the Muppets for exactly this reason. Nobody promotes iconic entertainment better than the Mouse.

I haven't read the screenplay for this new film or seen any footage except for the odd blurry cellphone grabs on YouTube. Nevertheless, this film from pitch to production has been very strong and thoughtful! To have any notion of it turning out otherwise at this point isn't mere skepticism - it's just plain negativity of the most unMuppety spirit.

Everyone is entitled to and opinion and my measured one is that I think we should just wait and see.

 

[Starchamberfall]

Disney moments:

The Aristocats (1970) The last animated feature produced during Walt Disney's lifetime. (Jim was not the only one who died too soon.) It had plenty of personality, it had its own personality. It stood on its own, but flowed right in to the rest of the creations. Very sweet and very 'personal'.

Robin Hood (1973) A few sparks, but could not draw enough out of what had gone before to be a new, Disney film in the sense the Aristocats was.

The Black Cauldron (1985) Few were in the theatre with me the night I saw this. It lumbered. It was no "Secret of Nimh". Unable to break the mold, really it was just the mold, just the Disney format showing through.

The Lion King (1994) When they started singing "The Circle of Life" I knew Walt Disney's reign at Walt Disney had ended, 24 years after his death: schmaltz was in. Schmaltz is of course a Yiddish word, and in English it means excessive sentimentality.
Not Jewish (if only!) and no longer Christian, Disney Studios had turned out to be just another studio with a history. Granted, you have some nice 'Walt Disney' touches from them on new projects, but I think the Muppets are out of focus at Disney because Disney is out of Disney.

 

[Drtooth]

They can remember that fart and crotch jokes are not a part of the past Muppets, and they don't belong in any other Muppet project. The Muppets had a sense of dignity, let's keep it that way.

Before someone else SKIMMS my post and puts words into my mouth that weren't there...

That comment came out of the fact that Henson has partnered with Weinstine, a company that lost a vast amount of money (I don't want to say they probably invested it with that Madoff guy, since it's probably not true... but I wouldn't put it past them)... they dragged their feet the entire time during the process of making the Fraggle Rock movie (which will NEVER happen). They also sat on the completely completed Hoodwinked 2 for well over a year (it's coming out in April) and... here's where my comment comes in... According to Cory Edwards's blog, Weinstine (at least in the trailer) added fart sounds and crotch bonk that weren't originally in the script. Considering they've (and by they, again, Weinstine) wanted Fraggles to have an "edgier" script, that gives me no hope that Henson can keep anything that isn't a CGI show about Dinosaurs going for more than a month.

Now the complaint that the new movie is going to be "hipped up?" NOTHING and I mean NOTHING is further from the truth. The script was penned by a team SICK of the new Muppet movies who wanted the glory of the original 3 films.

The only project made UNDER Disney and no one else has been Letter to Santa, and quite honestly, other than the short running time truncating the story, it was as close to the original Muppet feel as possible... or as you can possibly get with the story they chose. They recast OLD characters... the very same ones we were whining weren't used anymore.

Other than the fact that they've been overly careful lately (A few Muppet plush at Disney stores can't possibly hurt), they've really came a long way since they pawned the management to the Baby Einstine woman... really, a bunch of DVD's that have been denounced as quackery...

 

[CensoredAlso]

We've been griping about season 4 Muppet Show on DVD, but hey...Disney is the company that brought us seasons 1-3 on DVD

That's right and I'm really grateful to Disney for doing that. Like I said earlier, it is both Disney and Henson who could have been doing more to advertise the Muppets Jim created and not just keep reinventing them in projects that don't work.

 

[Daffyfan4ever]

When I think about it, I have to agree with a lot of the comments here. The Muppets haven't really seen the spotlight in quite a while. Heck, it was even Disney's decision to have an alternate performer for Kermit on "America's Got Talent" which didn't go over very well. We'll just have to wait and see how well they do with the upcoming movie.

 

[frogboy4]

Disney moments:

The Aristocats (1970) The last animated feature produced during Walt Disney's lifetime. (Jim was not the only one who died too soon.) It had plenty of personality, it had its own personality. It stood on its own, but flowed right in to the rest of the creations. Very sweet and very 'personal'.

Robin Hood (1973) A few sparks, but could not draw enough out of what had gone before to be a new, Disney film in the sense the Aristocats was.

The Black Cauldron (1985) Few were in the theatre with me the night I saw this. It lumbered. It was no "Secret of Nimh". Unable to break the mold, really it was just the mold, just the Disney format showing through.

The Lion King (1994) When they started singing "The Circle of Life" I knew Walt Disney's reign at Walt Disney had ended, 24 years after his death: schmaltz was in. Schmaltz is of course a Yiddish word, and in English it means excessive sentimentality.
Not Jewish (if only!) and no longer Christian, Disney Studios had turned out to be just another studio with a history. Granted, you have some nice 'Walt Disney' touches from them on new projects, but I think the Muppets are out of focus at Disney because Disney is out of Disney.

Those aren't Disney moments with the Muppet brand so I don't think you got the point - - Disney's handling of the Muppets in the last few years has been far better than the years preceding their ownership. There's a greater media consciousness and they are attempting to clear the post-Jim clutter and get the characters back to their roots in order to move forward. This is an attempt to rebuild the Muppets on their core classic Muppetiness than a facsimile of a facsimile that has been the former plan for the last two decades. It doesn't sound like you like post 90's Disney for personal reasons. I can respect that, but it has no bearing on how well they've been treating the Muppet brand right now.

While you might not have liked Disney's Lion King, it was a huuuge hit with audiences and critics alike that grossed $783,841,776 worldwide in 1994! Shmaltz or not (yes, I'm aware of the yiddish phrase) it's a good film that has it's darker moments too to counterbalance sentiment. That's the classic Disney method that I grew up with.

I've never found the Disney brand to be overly religious (Christian or Jewish) so that criticism is simply bizarre to me. Maybe there's something more widely political going on with that statement. I don't see that in Fantasia, Sleeping Beauty or most other classic pictures. They haven't made a film with slaves happily singing hymns while they work or dance with imaginary animals while they completely forget the brutality of having their human rights stripped away. I guess some people miss that era. I'm stepping far away from this can of creepiness now.

I suggest the recent documentary "Waking Sleeping Beauty" about the history and revival of Disney animation.

People have all different views of Disney and I have some conflicting views of them too. We are a spoiled instant-gratification culture. We've forgotten just how long films and entertainment properties used to get caught up in development helI. Some fans will complain no matter how the new film performs. There's a trade-off for Disney ownership, but I have high hopes.

 

[CensoredAlso]

I've never found the Disney brand to be overly religious (Christian or Jewish) so that criticism is simply bizarre to me.

Well there were Disney projects in the past with a clear religious vibe, such as the 1948 Johnny Appleseed cartoon, which frequently mentions God, the Bible and Heaven. Or The Sword in the Stone which declares: "It's a miracle! Ordained by Heaven, this boy is our King!" (They're not talking about the clouds ; ) ). And there was nothing objectionable about either project.

But that's off the topic of course.

 

[Yorick]

Not saying Pepe shouldn't be in the movie, but it's not like the Muppets were never edgy before he entered the picture.

Very true! I worded that wrong, ha. I meant to say Pepe is the most obvious choice to say and do the more outrageous things these days, so if they do plan to "modernize" the Muppets (as everyone does with everything these days - I'm not picking on Disney specifically) then I wouldn't think they'd ditch Pepe. Also, I think calling the movie "The Muppets" doesn't seem right. I know they want to re-introduce them in a big way, so that's probably why they're doing that, but still.

The kiddified Kermit's Swamp Years was before Disney. The cinematic mess of Muppets From Space that killed the Muppets career in films for over a decade was before Disney. The very odd French Muppet Show was before Disney. The many broken promises of a new primetime Muppet Show was before Disney.

I know what you mean about Swamp Years, but it was more of a subtle thing to me, so it still worked as a film for me, and I love it. As for Muppets From Space, I love that too, but I agree it should have been promoted better

We've been griping about season 4 Muppet Show on DVD, but hey...Disney is the company that brought us seasons 1-3 on DVD - something nobody had ever brought to viewers in all the years of the home video market. Is Disney perfect? Of course not. Do they care more about cash than sentiment? Of course they do, yet they've also learned that profits soar when both can go hand-in-hand.

Well said! I am thankful for seasons 1-3, and I'm sure it's not their fault we couldn't have Vincent Price singing "You've Got A Friend" (that was the only thing removed from Season 1, right?)

I haven't read the screenplay for this new film or seen any footage except for the odd blurry cellphone grabs on YouTube. Nevertheless, this film from pitch to production has been very strong and thoughtful! To have any notion of it turning out otherwise at this point isn't mere skepticism - it's just plain negativity of the most unMuppety spirit.

Everyone is entitled to and opinion and my measured one is that I think we should just wait and see.

I only know a few things (some are rumors I guess)...It's called "The Muppets", there's a promo pic with a new muppet that Jason S said he invented, Pepe may have a small role, and Jason S is directing it. But I'm also keeping from reading anything else if I can, to keep it a surprise. And I will try to be positive, but the thing is, my less that sure feeling about it has more to do with annoying "hip" writing in general these days than it does with Disney specifically - in this case.

 

[Yorick]

Jim was not the only one who died too soon.

Walt was around longer though. Not that that makes it okay for someone to die, believe me.

As for the other films you mention, I love Robin Hood and The Lion King, and I want to see The Black Cauldron. There's nothing wrong with The Lion King, or the songs for it.

And I agree with Frogboy4 on the religious thing. Never noticed it.