The Bible and Love and Christians

[CensoredAlso]

You have to have faith, you have to have that personal relationship with the Lord or the work that your doing will sadly be in vain. I know that is harsh, but that is what the word of God says.

Well no offence intended at all, but that's the point. I was always taught that such teaching was too harsh and in fact not in line with what Jesus was really getting at. Jesus was happy when people actively forgave and show compassion for others. He wasn't satisifed with people simply saying they believed in him. To paraphrase, he said if you really love me, then feed my sheep. Don't just say you love me, anyone can do that. Not everyone can do good works.

Now we can all get too picky of course, as Frogboy said both faith and good works are important. And to argue too much in one way or the other can become silly.

 

[dwayne1115]

Well no offence intended at all, but that's the point. I was always taught that such teaching was too harsh and in fact not in line with what Jesus was really getting at. Jesus was happy when people actively forgave and show compassion for others. He wasn't satisifed with people simply saying they believed in him. To paraphrase, he said if you really love me, then feed my sheep. Don't just say you love me, anyone can do that. Not everyone can do good works.

Now we can all get too picky of course, as Frogboy said both faith and good works are important. And to argue too much in one way or the other can become silly.

The thing is in some ways I think we are saying the same things, but not. Now don't get me wrong I'm still just learning this stuff, so it's not like I have been taught this my whole life.
If I'm saying that all you need to do is belive in God, and Jesus to get into heaven. Then that is defently not what I'm trying to say. Let me see if I can explain myself a little bit better here, because I don't want to say something that I don't belive.
Now from what I have said it seems that i have said all anyone needs to do is belive in God, and that is all they need to do. Ok, and from what you heralde are saying your works are what get you to heaven, am I right in saying that? So basicly what i belive is both of the things we belive are needed for us to live a chirstian life. I think you have to have both You have to have a true and personal relationship with the Lord, and then through that relationship comes the working. Now I hope I'm understanding what you are saying heralde, and that I think that for the most part we aggree. I'm wondering though. What type of works are you talking about? I ask that because I'm trying to learn more about what you belive.

 

[Drtooth]

You don't hear about the rational religious people from the media. It's only the fanatics that make eye catching headlines.

Seriously, fanatics are by their nature outside the norm. They don't represent religious people in general. Yet that's all anyone hears about.

Anyone, even if they aren't to be taken seriously that wants the world to end to see the ending is frightening. Some want to wait for the ending... and there just may be some that want to make the ending come sooner.

Yeah, the fanatics make more noise, but also, they want to make the most noise... it's about 50/50. People want to focus on the bad, but the bad wants people to focus on it.

Focusing on the End Times, in a thought I JUST had, LOL, is like level-skipping through a game just so you can "enjoy" the credits. The downside is that you never really could appreciate the GAME. Even if there's an Easter Egg epilogue after the credits, it really does you no good unless you took the time to play.

Well put. Same thing about finding the afterlife to be a "reward" instead of what it really is. Focusing too hard beyond life doesn't mean you'll have a high quality one living in the words of one's religion.

I'd make a joke about Utena, but I'm sure no one would get it, and I barely get it because my sister forced me to watch that one...

 

[CensoredAlso]

I think you have to have both You have to have a true and personal relationship with the Lord, and then through that relationship comes the working.

I get what you're saying, definitely. And like you and I both said, there's a danger in getting too bogged down into words and meanings.

I guess the concern some people have is the idea of God wanting the attention drawn to him first. The way I look at it, God's many concerned with how we try our fellow person, whether we have a relationship with him or not.

Anyone, even if they aren't to be taken seriously that wants the world to end to see the ending is frightening. Some want to wait for the ending... and there just may be some that want to make the ending come sooner.

OK, lol, I'm definitely not one of those crazy people. But I will say, is it really so strange that some people want the world to end? Everybody's in pain. And we're all looking to end it in various ways, whether through reading a good book, eating food or sadly taking drugs. And unfortunately, some people take it a little too far and think the solution is for the entire world to end.

 

[frogboy4]

I get what you're saying, definitely. And like you and I both said, there's a danger in getting too bogged down into words and meanings.

I guess the concern some people have is the idea of God wanting the attention drawn to him first. The way I look at it, God's many concerned with how we try our fellow person, whether we have a relationship with him or not.

I remember Christian Republican pundit and author of the highly critical book Godless, Ann Coulter saying several times that just because a person is a Christian doesn't mean they have to be nice to people. She even went as far as saying, "I'm a Christian first and a mean-spirited, bigoted conservative second, and don't you ever forget it." and that Jews should be "perfected" into Christians. I know she's just one obnoxious and extreme example of her faith, but I fear that deep down many Christians have the same kinds of feelings - that somehow their theological righteousness gives them license to belittle, mock and meddle in the lives of others rather than offer mutual respect without the intention of changing others to a Christian point of view. That's dangerous, especially the "perfected" ideal. While I understand what she's saying, it comes from a condescending place that robs the legitimacy of the spirituality that speaks to others the same way that Christianity speaks to Christians.

--to reiterate, I'm not citing all or even most Christians in this example, but too many to make me comfortable--

 

[CensoredAlso]

--to reiterate, I'm not citing all or even most Christians in this example

Good, because it is a little offensive to be compared to Ann Coulter with no evidence to back it up.

 

[frogboy4]

Good, because it is a little offensive to be compared to Ann Coulter with no evidence to back it up.

LOL! It's just one of those things that always stuck with me - that she kept repeating that just because you're a Christian doesn't mean you have to be nice to people. I'd never heard anyone actually come out and say that so plainly before! I'm not certain many people would actually support that, but as stated, I do think there are many Christians who believe it is their right to use aggressive tactics in order to convert non-Christians into their way of thinking because they believe that's the right thing to do. Why is it so hard for some folk to respectfully agree to disagree; to offer mutual respect and opportunity to those who think differently and move on?

 

[CensoredAlso]

I do think there are many Christians who believe it is their right to use aggressive tactics in order to convert non-Christians into their way of thinking because they believe that's the right thing to do. Why is it so hard for some folk to respectfully agree to disagree; to offer mutual respect and opportunity to those who think differently and move on?

Still frogboy, we're somewhat going in circles. You say you think a lot of Christians are a certain way, I point out that such a description could apply to anyone not just Christians, and you say I'm making excuses.

 

[frogboy4]

Still frogboy, we're somewhat going in circles. You say you think a lot of Christians are a certain way, I point out that such a description could apply to anyone not just Christians, and you say I'm making excuses.

I admit that the thread's gotten severely muffined by this and that (not at all my doing...i keep bring this back to the topic). This thread is called "The Bible and Love and Christians" and was started as one member's YouTube plea in the mist of the "It Gets Better" videos. In this clip he encourages Christians to live and let others be and to witness by personal example rather than legislation against gay rights. That's exactly why this point is brought up. It's not about "Muslims, the Koran and Love" or "Pesky Secularists getting rid of Christmas Trees".

Christianity is a major power-player and primary religious force in American life; and while many believers are content living open lives while showing respect for others, there are many activists (who actually don't think of themselves as activists) keeping others from thriving because of their belief that theirs is a divine mission. This thread explores why there's a need by these particular Christians to do that. Some Christians of that frame of mind have posted in this thread.

 

[CensoredAlso]

This thread is called "The Bible and Love and Christians" and was started as one member's YouTube plea in the mist of the "It Gets Better" videos. In this clip he encourages Christians to live and let others be and to witness by personal example rather than legislation against gay rights. That's exactly why this point is brought up. It's not about "Muslims, the Koran and Love" or "Pesky Secularists getting rid of Christmas Trees".

So even though every religion (and secular group) has its share of dangerous fanatics, we're only going to criticize one of them? Sorry but that's my problem with all this.