Your Thoughts: Kermit and Miss Piggy on America's Got Talent

[Daffyfan4ever]

Firstly, thanks to the mods for keeping this thread open - i do think that often the mods are way too quick to close threads and i'm glad they realized this wasn't really necessairy to do and re-opened it.

Yeah. I was thinking that too, but after seeing a heated argument between some people on this thread, I can sort of understand why. Still if people argue, they should be the ones that should be told about it, but still leave the thread open for the rest of us to post what we want to post.

But anyway, thanks again for reopening this. I think this is an interesting discussion.

 

[jonnytbird]

I thoguht that guy who did Kermit didn't do as near as good as Jim or Steve would have done it. My Mom and I both watched it together and it went from exciiment from downhill to the point of no return! My Mom hated it and so did I. Man I tell you, it keeps getting worse and worse for what they're doing to the muppets. But that's just my opinion.

 

[Luke]

I dont mind the voice being off because Its the muppets. I am just glad they are even doing a guest appearance . Disney could just let them die and even close down muppets 3d. I am gratefull for them even having a guest appearance.

The problem with thinking like that though is that if the performances are sub-standard Disney aren't exactly going to get great public feedback and they could stop the guest appearances or other Muppet projects. You have to aim high with what you do, not just settle for some mediocre level of Muppety goodness.

 

[muppetinsider]

It was definitely Artie Esposito. I just watched the Muppet in-house tapes they did with the new performers, and I must say, the new performers are amazing! You guys have no idea because you have not heard, and I certainly would not base Arite's performance on this first live **** pit they through him into.
The segments I saw are different Muppet type skits, they were taped in some rehearsal studio in Disney World. I also have a musical number of Zipidee Doo Daa, with Kermit, Gonzo, Piggy and Fozzie. One of the skits John Kennedy is doing Kermit, but he sounds a little to high-pitched and animated for my taste.
I gotta upload these onto youtube for all to judge for themselves. Now if I only new how to upload onto youtube!

 

[Drtooth]

SHUT UP! How can you say that? HOW CAN YOU SAY THAT? How can you...? Wow. WOW. How can you call yourself a Mupept fan? Steve Whitmire SAVED Kermit the Frog. Steve Whitmire IS KERMIT THE FROG. He has been for nineteen years, and he STILL IS. You just can't get off your high horse and accept the fact that Steve is GOOD. You just can't get out of the past and accept that the Muppets are a LIVING entity. They thrive on recasts WHEN A PERFORMER CAN NO LONGER PORTRAY THE CHARACTER. You need to get over yourself and realize that just because Jim Henson didn't do it, it doesn't mean it's not good.

Well said. I for one am sick and tired of the same "Waaah Waaah... Jim Henson is gone, and the Muppets should have died with him since everything they do sucks, and I don't want an open mind to appreciate anything for what it is," opinion. Listen... Charles Shulz took Snoopy and co with him. We had no closure on the strip, and every special we've had can only be made from pre-existing strips, making them seem boring and slapped together in some cases. On the other hand, we have characters like Mickey Mouse and Bugs Bunny, and they didn't die with their creators. They're still making projects up to the discretion of the company owners. And YES, they aren't as good as the originals because they aren't the originals. But most of them are good for what they are. And frankly, I think the best Mickey Mouse projects came well after Walt's death... the late Wayne Alwine (sp) actually brought a personality to the character not even Walt could give him.

Jim WANTED the muppets to keep going, and I think everyone has forgotten that. Of course we're gonna have a lot of experiments in trying to capture the spirit, and a lot of them will fail. Look at MWOZ. They wrote that for everyone BUT the muppets, and due to stunt casting, the film just felt plasticy. LTS WAS great. Really short, but it proved you can get that feeling back, or as close to it as possible, if you try. Do I think we'll ever see another MTM and GMC? No... but they shoudln't stop trying. I think they're in a good place now. We just have a crummy media landscape where they have to have appearances on other shows instead of their own program. The internet videos and comic books are brilliant, and frankly, the best muppet projects I've seen in years. Again, look how long it took Disney to get on its feet after Walt. they're gonna stumble several times before they get footing.

And lastly, this is a surprise recast/fill in. Of course it's gonna sound off. Steve's Kermit sounded off the first time... Eric's Piggy, Fozzie, Grover and Bert sounded off too. We said the same thing about the surprise recast of Robin. Plus, this was probably a first time for the puppeteer as well... he needs to find his voice. A character has to come deep within a performer. They don't just toss a puppet at someone and say "do Kermit's voice." Look how long it took them to officially recast Scooter. And with someone who had a history of being recast for Richard Hunt's roles... even as Sweetums that one time in The Cosby Show, while RIchard was performing another character at the time. And unless we hear something official, I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt here. Steve was somehow unavailable, and the performance was scheduled long in advance, and they couldn't cancel it.

 

[Barry Lee]

Besides the fact that Kermit wasn't performed by Steve (which is a shock but sometimes in show business things happen and theres times where the show MUST go on) What has happened to originality with the Muppets as far as being LIVE?

We had so many great LIVE original skits on variety sketch shows etc, and now we just have Kermit or Piggy singing with a celebrity or together. Bring in some other characters.

 

[Frogster]

Oh, yes, OBVIOUSLY. Because they aren't being booked on high-profile television shows like America's Got Talent. No, no, they're not garnering OVER FIVE MILLION views on their official YouTube videos (which I STILL don't think you've seen). Of course they're not running an extremely popular official website introducing them to a new age of fans while remaining true and classic to their original fans. They're definitely not recieving awards such as a Webby, Emmy, or Grammy. No, no, the public hates them, you're right.


...Whatever. Excuse ME, mister so called old-school Henson fan, but Letters to Santa was CLASSIC. It was brilliantly wonderful. Did you see that? Were you watching the same special? Did you witness the brilliant, elaborate musical numbers? Did you notice that Kermit, Fozzie, and Gonzo were a trio once more? Did you happen to hear the Electric Mayhem had more than a line each? Did you perchance notice that SCOOTER, ROBIN, ROWLF, THE ENTIRE ELECTRIC MAYHEM, BEAUREGARD, POPS, SWEETUMS, and LEW ZEALAND all appeared (most with speaking roles)? What the on earth isn't classic about that? Tell me, please. People don't care about the Muppets? WHATEVER. After Letters to Santa aired, I had TONS of people come up to me and tell me how much they LOVED it. Muppet fans are reporting non-Muppet fans coming up to them and telling them how much they enjoyed last night's appearance. The public LIKES THE MUPPETS. They always have. They just NEED TO SEE THEM MORE.


...Shut. Up. You obviously have NO idea what you're talking about. You have NO idea who these characters are. You have NO idea what it takes to BE a character. Any Tom, Dick, or Harry can do a Beaker impression and wiggle him around. Same with Kermit. But it takes practice and time and... wow. I can't believe have to explain this to you. Steve simply said that he didn't know where Beaker came from inside Richard. WHY is that NOT perfectly logical? WHY can't a performer take PRIDE in someone ELSE's character and dedicate himself to making it the SAME as before? Ridiculous, sir. Ridiculous.


Once again, you obviously have NO idea what you're talking about. If ANYONE understands the Muppets is people like Steve, Eric, Jim Lewis, Bill Baretta, and Kirk Thatcher. NOT you. Riddle me this, how do YOU understand the Muppets, and people who have worked with them for YEARS not? Unbelievable. I'm... just disgusted.


SHUT UP! How can you say that? HOW CAN YOU SAY THAT? How can you...? Wow. WOW. How can you call yourself a Mupept fan? Steve Whitmire SAVED Kermit the Frog. Steve Whitmire IS KERMIT THE FROG. He has been for nineteen years, and he STILL IS. You just can't get off your high horse and accept the fact that Steve is GOOD. You just can't get out of the past and accept that the Muppets are a LIVING entity. They thrive on recasts WHEN A PERFORMER CAN NO LONGER PORTRAY THE CHARACTER. You need to get over yourself and realize that just because Jim Henson didn't do it, it doesn't mean it's not good.


How do you know that? Hmm? Frank Oz has stated MANY times that he left to pursue his career in directing. It was a LIFE decision, not a spur of the moment, ****** off at the state of things decision.


I'm going to say this now... but if you are going to post this CRAP, you should get off the forum now. I'm not the only one who's going to "attack" you for saying unfounded crap like this. Again, you don't know WHAT you're talking about.


Go to Muppets.com and eat your words.


...Who the **** are you to tell me what I should consider myself? You do NOT have the authority to do that. You do NOT understand the Muppets--this post proves that. You obviously don't care about them anymore, so why are you still posting here?

This post is no doubt going to be deleted and I may be in trouble for it... but Frogster expressed his ridiculous opinion, I should be allowed to defend mine.

I have kept up on the Muppets. I've seen the specials, the webbys, what have you. I'd say the web spots and the appearance on SNL with Horatio Sanz are the only two things worth mentioning in 10 years.

And sorry... ERIC JACOBSON. Sorry if I couldn't remember the guy who could puppeteer and kind of do Oz's voices. He was in the right place at the right time. Doesn't really mean he's good.

Speaking of Oz, if it sounded like I insulted him, that's not what I meant to do. All I said was, "Oz left, only to be taken over by Eric." And of course he's going to say publicly that he left to pursue his directing career. Nobody knows for sure if there's any other reason why he left.

And America's Got Talent? I thought most people understood that reality television is garbage. It's David Hasselhoff and Sharon Osbourne. These people, like the Muppets, haven't really done anything extraordinary in almost 20 years. It's superficial, and nobody who wins those contests actually get big afterwards. Sure they'll do a few shows here and there but it doesn't last long. For the most part, if you're any type of celebrity, and you're appearing on something like America's Got Talent, American Idol or So You Think You Can Dance, you're obviously not a very busy celebrity.

Letters to Santa could have been done by the people at Sesame Street and the acting style and plot would remain the same. BTW I know Steve doesn't write the stuff he says, but he is the performer, and that's kind of important when you're the guy who's supposed to be doing Kermit The Frog.

And prawn, your eccentric responses make you look somewhat obsessive. It's good to pull yourself back to reality every now and again. I didn't say that NOBODY cared for the Muppets, or that everybody hates them, just that the larger viewing audience could pretty much take them or leave them, and they wouldn't really care if they did a special or not.

I understand the Muppets because I was still around when Henson was alive. I remember seeing A Muppet Family Christmas when I was a little kid on TV. I also understand that projects like Muppets Tonight and Muppets From Space should never have been done. You're right, these people do understand the Muppets better than I do, but they're not showing it.

I'm sorry, ever since The Muppets Celebrate Jim Henson, I cannot stand Kermit's voice. That is my opinion. Steve's Kermit shows no adult-like mannerisms, and he certainly doesn't carry the rest of the crew like he did back in, say, The Muppets Take Manhattan. He's a push-over, he's too loud, and very annoying.

 

[Drtooth]

And America's Got Talent? I thought most people understood that reality television is garbage. It's David Hasselhoff and Sharon Osbourne. These people, like the Muppets, haven't really done anything extraordinary in almost 20 years. It's superficial, and nobody who wins those contests actually get big afterwards. Sure they'll do a few shows here and there but it doesn't last long. For the most part, if you're any type of celebrity, and you're appearing on something like America's Got Talent, American Idol or So You Think You Can Dance, you're obviously not a very busy celebrity.

That's the one thing I think I really can agree with. I HATE this kind of crap, and I said I'd only watch it if they appeared within the first 15 minutes of the show. Honestly, this kind of stuff can't be helped because it's such a huge, huge hit with people that love to watch reality TV shows because they are bad. I'm sorry, but watching a B-movie because it's bad is one thing... it becomes cult. And watching reality TV because it's bad leads to a fall line up of clones of the same shows, and a summer replacement of NOTHING but clones of the clones. I wish they could appear in better programming. I loved what the SS characters were doing in Scrubs... why can['t the Muppets get some sort of odd spot on another sitcom? It would be great to get them on the Office the same way they got Jack Black on there... Have Michael Scott watch some exclusive muppet segment or something. It sucks the media landscape has changed to Reality TV shows by the billions.

 

[Luke]

I must say, the new performers are amazing! You guys have no idea because you have not heard, and I certainly would not base Arite's performance on this first live **** pit they through him into.

I know some of the people who were there, i know there are some talented performers who did well ... and yeah it does look like somehow Artie was thrown into this at the deep end - but to me it says a lot about how Diz really regard the Mups that they even contemplated putting an alternate performer in something this big. It baffles me. They say everything about how they respect the Muppets and they let something obviously little rehearsed and last minute go ahead .. regardless of the performers, wheres the quality control?

When you say "new performers" it sounds like you are suggesting this isn't a "one off" and the whole alternate performers thing is going ahead as per the vision years ago. Is that the case?

 

[redBoobergurl]

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And prawn, your eccentric responses make you look somewhat obsessive. It's good to pull yourself back to reality every now and again. I didn't say that NOBODY cared for the Muppets, or that everybody hates them, just that the larger viewing audience could pretty much take them or leave them, and they wouldn't really care if they did a special or not.
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Ok I was going to keep my mouth shut, I don't get into these debates usually, but dude, you just insulted my friend, so I'm not too happy right now.

Prawnie's response was NOT obsessive. He was speaking as a TRUE Muppet fan, and you know what, he is someone I look up to and admire a great deal and he's nearly ten years younger than me, but you know what, I don't care. He is smart and quite possibly the MOST optimistic Muppet fan out there. And I agree 100% with his responses.

I grew up with the Classic Muppets, but I still respect and appreciate Steve's performances and feel that he did help save Kermit and the Muppets from winding up on shelf somewhere. So you know what? Don't assume that the general public could take or leave them or care if they do specials or not. There are lots of people out there like me who may just not say much.