If JIM HENSON was alive TODAY

[frogboy4]

I would have agreed with you on that point up until I saw this clip some months ago.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1-PwZltH8E

Anyone with any more details? This leads me to believe that Jim was full steam ahead with developing Muppets Tonight just before he passed...

Clifford was not created for Muppets Tonight. He was a regular on the Jim Henson Hour. This Arsenio Hall Show was Jim's final television appearance. They were promoting a Disney special that had just been shot. Muppets Tonight was more vaudevillian than it seems would have suited Jim. He wanted to bring the Muppets forward from the Muppet Show and not back. However, as a fan I appreciated MT. I found the Henson Hour a little disappointing for lack of a classic feel that MT actually has.

 

[CensoredAlso]

I don't like to speculate on what another person would think or do. But I do get the impression he was disapointed in Henson Hour's cancellation since that was a big effort in his moving forward technology-wise. Perhaps he would have made another attempt in that area (which I admit I would have preferred hehe).

 

[frogboy4]

I don't like to speculate on what another person would think or do. But I do get the impression he was disapointed in Henson Hour's cancellation since that was a big effort in his moving forward technology-wise. Perhaps he would have made another attempt in that area (which I admit I would have preferred hehe).

That is a good point. Most of what I posted has been said before and came from interviews from Jim himself like this one. The animated film idea is in there in his own words.

Other than that I do know he always wanted to move things forward rather than back. Muppets Tonight was homage to the Muppet Show, but it didn't update the premise as much as his Henson Hour did. That's one of the few points I disagreed with in Jim's assessment of the Muppets. He leaned toward to much emphasis on new characters and that is in part why both Hour and Tonight weren't the hits they should have been. Who knows if the Muppets would be popular right now if Jim were living?

Right now the Muppets have great, young performers (along with a couple of seasoned veterans) to breath new life and energy that I feel the gang needed even back in 1990. There's an excitement factor. Possibilities. Sure, they aren't going to be the same as in Jim's day. Those fans out there who want that can live in a hermetically sealed bubble of old media only. I see myself as a more daring and avid fan and I'm pulling for the characters to get over the slump and see what is beyond. I don't think they've ever had a real opportunity.

 

[CensoredAlso]

Those fans out there who want that can live in a hermetically sealed bubble of old media only. I see myself as a more daring and avid fan and I'm pulling for the characters to get over the slump and see what is beyond. I don't think they've ever had a real opportunity.

Well that's the big debate really among fans, hehe. Which is fine, nearly every big franchise has these never-really-resolved-debates that serve to keep the thing alive, hehe. For my part, I don't see perferring the past as "undaring", I just see it as recognizing the best work. But I won't quibble, I think there's room for both.

My concern though is, I think the past Muppet projects have nearly gone out of the public consciousness in recent years. The Muppets have not been given the respect so many other classic forms of media have, for several reasons. One, older media in general is getting a bad rap. But also, there's been a lot of attention placed on putting out newer Muppet projects (that have not attracted the same huge followings) and not enough attention on perserving the older ones.

It's the people behind the Muppets' responsibility to keep the past work alive, Jim's work alive, and I don't feel it's happened. I know they're trying their best. But it's hard out there right now for classic media, and even more so for the Muppets.

The newer projects have had many opportunities to reclaim and it hasn't happened. That doesn't mean it won't ever, I'm open to the idea. But I'd prefer for there to be some balance between the old and new.

 

[frogboy4]

Well that's the big debate really among fans, hehe. Which is fine, nearly every big franchise has these never-really-resolved-debates that serve to keep the thing alive, hehe. For my part, I don't see perferring the past as "undaring", I just see it as recognizing the best work. But I won't quibble, I think there's room for both.

My concern though is, I think the past Muppet projects have nearly gone out of the public consciousness in recent years. The Muppets have not been given the respect so many other classic forms of media have, for several reasons. One, older media in general is getting a bad rap. But also, there's been a lot of attention placed on putting out newer Muppet projects (that have not attracted the same huge followings) and not enough attention on perserving the older ones.

It's the people behind the Muppets' responsibility to keep the past work alive, Jim's work alive, and I don't feel it's happened. I'm not saying it's anyone's fault, I think they are trying their best. But it's hard out there right now for classic media, and even more so for the Muppets.

The newer projects have had many opportunities to reclaim and it hasn't happened. That doesn't mean it won't ever, I'm open to the idea. But I'd prefer for there to be some balance between the old and new.

Some fans don't want any new media from the Muppets. That's what I was talking about. I prefer the classic projects. Preference wasn't my point. There seems to be a classic media crusade you have going whatever the thread and I get that. Just seems to me that you're reading more into my post than what was there. I do favor a balance, but there's no pleasing everybody 100%.

New media is what helps salvage classic media. That's just the way it works. Just like death and taxes - there's just no changing that. However, once knowing that fact there is much that can be done to work within it that hasn't been given enough opportunity.

Still, that's not the point of this thread. It's about what Jim would do. The link I posted was of his last comprehensive magazine interview. Did you actually read it? It is interesting.

 

[CensoredAlso]

New media is what helps salvage classic media. That's just the way it works.

I just think that's not what's happened in the case of the Muppets. One has not helped the other.

The link I posted was of his last comprehensive magazine interview. Did you actually read it? It is interesting.

I have read it, thanks it definitely says a lot. I love that Jim was so far seeing with computer animation. It's sad in a way that his early contributions to the field are not always remembered now. Still, I'm sure he'd just be happy the advances have happened at all.

Also, I think if Disney was still as successful now as it was in 1990, things might be different for the Muppets.

 

[frogboy4]

I just think that's not what's happened in the case of the Muppets. One has not helped the other.



I have read it, thanks it definitely says a lot. I love that Jim was so far seeing with computer animation. It's sad in a way that his early contributions to the field are not always remembered now. Still, I'm sure he'd just be happy the advances have happened at all.

Also, I think if Disney was still as successful now as it was in 1990, things might be different for the Muppets.

You're right. There has been little follow-through with any Muppet plans since Jim. I still say the biggest failure to me was in Disney's gross lack of promotion for Muppet Treasure Island (the only release not featured in the E Channel's coming attractions weekly trailer program that year) in so many areas. Also the worminess of Muppets Tonight's timeslot regularity and promotion was lacking. Then, of course, there was Muppets From Space that did receive promotion but performed poorly due to its spotty execution. It might be a fave of some fans, but that movie hurt the Muppets in ways we are still feeling today. The Muppets have been so horribly handled, but I fault the fact that the Henson Company couldn't cope with the largeness of the Muppets without Jim Henson.

Jim's efforts were always so solid that on the rare occasion something didn't work (like Labyrinth) he just couldn't wrap his mind around it. He had more successes than most entertainers in his position and it wasn't by luck or accident. The Muppets really need a leader like him that knows what is best and really cares for them (without being precious, of course). The Muppet brand really needs its own CEO that only thinks of their interests.

 

[CensoredAlso]

The Muppets really need a leader like him that knows what is best and really cares for them (without being precious, of course). The Muppet brand really needs its own CEO that only thinks of their interests.

Absolutely! I mean, one is tempted to say "You can't go home again." I know I often am! But then again, we have to admit, that CEO of Disney in the '90s did manage to make Disney rise again after years of virtual silence. So it's not entirely out of the question. I just think fans disagree on what direction is best. Still, I'd like to think that Jim would be intrigued by fans from all over being able to discuss his work on a grand scale like the Internet.

 

[JimmyDeanDog]

Good posts all -

I brought this topic up from just a 'fleeting thought',
so we gotta let the past go, accept the reason(s)
why God took Jim away from this earth - -

- and continue to look ahead in moving onward and upward!

Maybe Frank still 'hears' Jim at times via telepathy;
and if this is so - that's reassuring...


-JDD

 

[RyGuy]

If Jim were Alive today a lot of things would be different ( my reasoing doesn't pertain to his Muppet work ) . If Mr. Henson were still with us these things would be a signifcant decrease in the following things:

There wouldn't be as many elementray school fights/ suspensions. I say this because children today lack suitable role models . I mean our generations had actual human rrole models (Mr. Rogers was essentially a gentle guidance cunselor for preschoolers , who verbally squeezed preschoolers hands tight and took them on field trips to places and gave information at a childs level. and invited preschoolers to his "house "for comfort "He should have ended with the saying "If you have a fear or problem I'm right here for you, just write me at .. " that would have shown even more care . Childrent learn best when a human talks to them .

Jim could have given 9/11 PSA's (we are at war but your child should be safe from harm , please talk to your children honestly about terrorsisim at these uncertain times ) I'm sure he wouldn't have even had Kermit do that type of message due to the serious message he would have been conveying)

He would have his personal website complete with audio messages from some of the muppets he played and he would have had a "contact me " option on it

He may have done a "Kermit and Me " program where he held kermit on his arm and just chatted about a subject with the audenice (sounds relaxing) He could have opened it by saying "A lot of times when Kermit and I are together I'm under him but now we're together face to fo face and he could he read viewer maill and answered viewer questions .

Those are my thoughts.