Copyrighting puppets

[staceyrebecca]

Luke, thank you. Invaluable. A story that kind-of relates... Some friends of mine were travelling to Tronoto to perform at an improv festival. Of course they got stopped at the border & were asked about a work visa. They insisted they weren't working becuse they weren't getting paid & the border officer said, "But you're getting paid in recognition."

While that's no reason to require a work permit, it does put this into perspective a little.


Ok I have more questions...(of course I do)
In the situation where I sold these puppets to the ad agency, *do* the rights go with them? I mean, we discussed them being used for that commercial, but we never had discussed future use. Can they use them in commercials for other companies? TV, etc? When no contract is signed, who retains the rights?

I know that if the Coyotes fired this ad agency, the Coyotes would not have the rights to run those ads. My husband used to be an ad creative, but that's all I could get out of him.

 

[ravagefrackle]

it's a good idea to build up a good relationship because producers and researchers do keep contacts books and may well come back to you somewhere down the road. .

BUt dont trust them,any further than you can throw them

 

[puppetsmith]

Ok I have more questions...(of course I do)
In the situation where I sold these puppets to the ad agency, *do* the rights go with them? I mean, we discussed them being used for that commercial, but we never had discussed future use. Can they use them in commercials for other companies? TV, etc? When no contract is signed, who retains the rights?

I know that if the Coyotes fired this ad agency, the Coyotes would not have the rights to run those ads. My husband used to be an ad creative, but that's all I could get out of him.

Excellent question. You will find this document helpful in answering the question - http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ09.pdf

Here's a quote from the publication:

If a work is created by an independent contractor (that
is, someone who is not an employee under the general
common law of agency), then the work is a specially ordered
or commissioned work, and part 2 of the statutory definition
applies. Such a work can be a work made for hire only if both
of the following conditions are met: (1) it comes within one
of the nine categories of works listed in part 2 of the definition
and (2) there is a written agreement between the parties
specifying that the work is a work made for hire.

"Work for hire" or "work made for hire" are legal terms with a specific legal definition. Certain conditions must be met for a work to be considered a "work for hire" under copyright law. If those conditions are not met than the rights by law automatically remain with the creator of the work.

In your case the second condition - a written agreement between the parties specifying that the work is a work made for hire - was not met, and that is at the very least.

 

[Luke]

In the situation where I sold these puppets to the ad agency, *do* the rights go with them? I mean, we discussed them being used for that commercial, but we never had discussed future use.

Bezazel had an excellent answer. As long as you can prove copyright (that you made them) they would need to come back to you before they could use them again. The reality of it is that they could try to use them again without permission or even realising they need it, and the legal action if you chose to chase them on it might be costly, but i wouldn't worry until anything actually happened. Just make a point of having something in writing next time as these things are far easier to sort out when you do.

... and yes RavageFrackle, trust no-one! lol

 

[staceyrebecca]

So I *do* maintain copyright, but need to prove that I made them (which is easily done as I sign & date all of my work.

I'm not worried about it necessarily. The guys at the agency used to work with my husband at a different agency (which is weird that they found me via other means).

I should do a google search for contract templates & such.

-stacey

 

[CBPuppets]

Okay I'm Confused......why would you want to send letters to yourself. and why couldn't you make like a "Work Cited" type resource from one of those internet pages like Wikipedia? I'm Sorry if this sounds confusing.

 

[MGov]

The idea of the "poor man's copyright", mailing it to yourself by registered mail, is that, when you receive it back, you don't open it so that there is a date stamp from the post office over the flap. It's supposed to prove that it existed in your possession as of that date.

I'm not sure what you mean by a "'Work Cited' type resource from one of those internet pages like Wikipedia" though I know that Wikipedia has user generated content and therefore wouldn't hold up in court if you had to sue.

 

[ravagefrackle]

not to cause more confusion, but we covered the "Poor Mans Copyright" thing earlier

and it is a waste of time, it is not something that will stand up in court, if you want a proper copyright then its worth the moeny investing in one,

 

[CBPuppets]

Oh....I see. Sounds like alot of work just to Copyright a Puppet.

 

[Luke]

Oh....I see. Sounds like alot of work just to Copyright a Puppet.

It always pays to protect yourself, especially when doing anything for film or tv. You could be gambling tens of thousands for the sake of a few hundred bucks legal fee's. You never know when something can hit the big time and people only usually learn after a few bad experiences.

Often legal documents and agreements can be drawn up generically and re-used anyway.