What year did it all change for the worst?

[wiley207]

I'm not sure. The show has always been experimental. Heck, you compare an episode from 1987 with an episode from 1971 and you're gonna notice several differences!

But as for a year when they really changed, I'm gonna have to go with 1993. By this point, they had to compete with Barney, hence the whole "Around the Corner" thing, those crazy new Muppets that hogged the screentime (the Squirrelles and the Furry Arms Hotel employees anyone?), becoming a bit more childish, and the use of the trained child actors (again ala Barney) instead of really young actual children and often improvising with them, among when they began "updating" classic segments with new music and stuff. Not only that, but 1993 was when I stopped watching, by the end of Season 24 (the new opening and closing weren't so bad when used with that season, and I also am probably one of the few that counts Season 24 as the final "classic" season.)
I also noticed that the only character that was prominent during that "Around the Corner" era that survived after its demise was Benny Rabbit. But then again, he debuted in 1991, before he became a bellhop rabbit, and even back then he still had his distinct grumpy personality.

 

[Oscarfan]

I seriously don't think the amount of classic clips used during a season really defines whether or not a season is good or not. It's really rests on the new material and how good it is.

 

[D'Snowth]

Benny didn't really survive so much: he had some longevity since dismantling ATC, but it's been few and far between. Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Benny end up becoming one of those "rejected" Muppets that got shipped overseas to be a regular character on an international co-production within the last few years or so? Like Sesamstraat, I believe?

 

[Drtooth]

I seriously don't think the amount of classic clips used during a season really defines whether or not a season is good or not. It's really rests on the new material and how good it is.

That's a distinction that frankly gets even less meaningful when you realize that most of those classic clips are somewhere online. It's not so much the lack of classic clips that's the current show's problem. The lack of newer footage sticks out like a soar thumb. I do believe, however, older segments could help remedy that. And since ETM takes up less space than EW, there seems to be more of an opportunity to put something short from the last 2 decades in. Too bad they resort to "getting their money's worth" and reusing parody/celebrity segments twice a season.

 

[cjd874]

I was a child of the late 90s, so I grew up with SS right after ATC came to an end. There were early signs of the radical change that was to come, such as the Tickle Me Elmo craze and those quick bits where a Muppet would introduce a segment, like Ernie & Rubber Duckie announcing the letter of the day.
I would say that it was Season 32 when it REALLY changed for the worst. That was when we saw Journey to Ernie, the Letter/Number of the Day segments, and various other predictable segments, not to mention Elmo's World. This was also when Frank and Jerry's main Muppets stopped appearing for a few years (we only saw the Count and Cookie for a while, very little Bert, Grover, Mumford, Herry, etc). It just didn't have the same authentic feel as the Street of the past three decades. It felt like it was commercialized to the extreme (Zoe in a tutu to appeal to younger girls, for example).
Nowadays, we have Abby's Flying Fairy School taking up just as much time as Elmo the Musical. I don't mean to come off as rude, but in my honest opinion the show might as well be the Abby and Elmo Show.

 

[Oscarfan]

Couple of corrections:

• That's season 33
• AFFS actually came before ETM, and EW was way longer than Fairy School

If you look at the show now, yes, Elmo and Abby have their own portions, but Grover's getting a lot of momentum; he's been in practically every show this season. Some episodes have given him a Super Grover 2.0 bit, then another sketch with him right afterward.

 

[cjd874]

Couple of corrections:

• That's season 33
• AFFS actually came before ETM, and EW was way longer than Fairy School

If you look at the show now, yes, Elmo and Abby have their own portions, but Grover's getting a lot of momentum; he's been in practically every show this season. Some episodes have given him a Super Grover 2.0 bit, then another sketch with him right afterward.

Oh yes, you're right. Sorry about that season 32/33 error. It's been a while since I've watched SS daily.

 

[Drtooth]

Here's the wonderful thing about season 33. None of the people involved with the show liked it either, and it changed quite quickly after that. Journey to Ernie was completely awful in its first incarnation, but the following season, they changed the concept completely so it was actually enjoyable. Had the Two Headed Monster in every segment. That can't be bad. And it didn't even last 3 seasons even after they changed it. The letter and number introductions would change too, and back in season 39, they really changed them up, back to being connected to the main street story most of the time, hosted by the regular cast. They even tried to, but to no avail, bring the show back to the original roots of being interrupted by segments instead of having the street story be one solid 15 minute block. Unfortunately, it didn't take the 2 episodes they tried it.

The thing is, the will to change the show back is there, but they painted themselves into quite a corner otherwise. Of course, the block format not only brought the show back very good ratings, but it also got back the very same 4-5 year olds they lost pandering to the 3 and under crowd. There are rumblings that Abby's Flying Fairy School is no longer in production... if that is true, I accept it because it's basically just reruns 90% of the time.

 

[minor muppetz]

I would say that it was Season 32 when it REALLY changed for the worst. That was when we saw Journey to Ernie, the Letter/Number of the Day segments, and various other predictable segments, not to mention Elmo's World. This was also when Frank and Jerry's main Muppets stopped appearing for a few years (we only saw the Count and Cookie for a while, very little Bert, Grover, Mumford, Herry, etc).

Somebody already corrected you about those segments premiering in season 33, but actually Frank's characters started to appear more in seasons 32 and 33. It was around this time that they were beginning to be performed by other people (though Muppet Wiki claims Eric Jacobson had began as Grover and Bert in 1997. I don't know what that source is, but I first heard about these recasts in 2001, and don't know of any pre-season 32 episodes where he performed either. Unless he was being trained for a few years before he started doing them on the show).

 

[Oscarfan]

Somebody already corrected you about those segments premiering in season 33, but actually Frank's characters started to appear more in seasons 32 and 33. It was around this time that they were beginning to be performed by other people (though Muppet Wiki claims Eric Jacobson had began as Grover and Bert in 1997. I don't know what that source is, but I first heard about these recasts in 2001, and don't know of any pre-season 32 episodes where he performed either. Unless he was being trained for a few years before he started doing them on the show).

He did Grover as early as season 30; he's doing Grover in "I'm Talkin' Love" and you can hear him doing Grover in "Gospel Alphabet". The only example of him doing Bert before season 32 I know of is the season 31 sketch where Elmo talks about emotions.