Thoughts on Convincing John

[CensoredAlso]

I get the impression John performs the gig asked of him at the moment and nothing more. Otherwise, his reputation for being a reliable convincer might suffer.

 

[DTWolf]

I was surprised to find out in the "Secret" episode that C-John himself couldn't make decisions; it struck me as not really fitting in with the character. But maybe it does. In the episode they say, basically, "He's indecisive because he can see every side of every issue--which also means he can convince people of anything, since he can see a way to defend any given position."

I wonder if in addition to that, the reason he takes these jobs is because he doesn't have to decide at all. Whoever hires him says, "Convince people of THIS," and he does, because he can give himself fully to that THIS and be freed from the anxiety of indecision. The fraggle hiring him tells him what to believe and it's so much easier for him that way.

 

[CensoredAlso]

Right, although that brings up a dark point. Would he ever be able to turn down an offer if it was morally wrong? Maybe that's also why he's considered so dangerous.

Relativism in the extreme, the idea that nothing can be right or wrong. Which means anything could be justified.

Wembley, at least, can tell the difference between right and wrong when it's important.

 

[Giar Fraggle]

While Cantus is Jim's deep and thoughtful character, Convincing John is his purely entertaining character. Just thinking about him makes me laugh and laugh because he's just so rediculously flashy and hyperactive (and his song is SO CATCHY). He is just the sort of lighthearted silliness that perfectly counteracts Cantus's somber nobility.

 

[minor muppetz]

I think it's strange that he wasn't used more in The Preacification of Convincing John. His name is in the title, but aside from a few mentions, he only appears in his two musical numbers. We don't even see what Mokey and Red's visit to his cave was like.

For awhile, I wondered if Jim Henson actually did the puppetry, since all of his lines in that episode are sung, and would have been recorded before the episode was tapped. Henson was directing the episode, so he could have just stayed behind the camera while somebody else performed Convincing John to an audio recording. But then I realised that his movements were very similar to the movements of other "wild" Jim Henson characters like Mahna Mahna and Guy Smiley, and I found a post by Terry Angus that pretty much confirmed that it was Jim performing Convincing John in this episode.

 

[CensoredAlso]

Well, I know Convincing John was performed by Jim Henson in his second episode, "The Secret of Convincing John." In the old '80s Muppet documentary "Henson's Place", they have footage of Jim performing him, with Kathy, Richard and Dave doing his back up singers.

 

[Giar Fraggle]

Besides, it's not completely impossible to direct and act in the same production. Just look at Dark Crystal and MTM.

 

[minor muppetz]

Besides, it's not completely impossible to direct and act in the same production. Just look at Dark Crystal and MTM.

I know. There are quite a few productions where the director also acted in. And I guess it would be easier to direct and perform in the same production if it was a puppet production, as the performers can see what is going on by looking into the monitors.

Of course, I have read that there was an episode of Welcome Back, Kotter, titled Close Encounters of the Carvelli Kind, that was directed by one of the cast members, but for some reason he couldn't appear on-screen and get a directors credit, so he wasn't in that episode. I have read somewhere that it's because the show was video tapped instead of filmed, and the director had to spend all his time inside a controll room.

 

[CensoredAlso]

I read that about Welcome Back, Kotter as well, in a Nick at Nite guide. I guess that makes sense if the show's recorded "live on tape before a studio audience".

 

[Super Scooter]

For awhile, I wondered if Jim Henson actually did the puppetry, since all of his lines in that episode are sung, and would have been recorded before the episode was tapped. Henson was directing the episode, so he could have just stayed behind the camera while somebody else performed Convincing John to an audio recording. But then I realised that his movements were very similar to the movements of other "wild" Jim Henson characters like Mahna Mahna and Guy Smiley, and I found a post by Terry Angus that pretty much confirmed that it was Jim performing Convincing John in this episode.

Yeah, I find you can often times tell who is performing a character just from the way they perform the puppet. Jim Henson and Jerry Nelson both have their own style that is somewhat easy to identify. Bill Barretta, too, come to think of it.

If you can't tell from the voice, check the performance!