The Muppets Kitchen with Cat Cora

[Mupp]

Oh, certainly not. Subtlety isn't my strong suit. Why would you think I wrote that to you personally or meant it as an insult?

Let's just say that I've had run-ins with some bad eggs on other message boards in the past. I have that kind of luck.

This is one of the very few message boards I am still active on.

Thanks for the clarification. I had a feeling that it was nothing to worry about, but I just wanted to ask.

 

[frogboy4]

Let's just say that I've had run-ins with some bad eggs on other message boards in the past. I have that kind of luck.

This is one of the very few message boards I am still active on.

Thanks for the clarification. I had a feeling that it was nothing to worry about, but I just wanted to ask.

Nah. I'm very opinionated, but that's why people come to forums. But there's mutual respect.

Incidentally, I did have a little bit of Photoshop fun with Angelo the other day. I gave him eyes etc to see what might make the existing design more Muppety. I wasn't happy with the results, but it looked a little friendlier than the existing puppet. I might post it sometime.

There's a part of me that would be tickled to see Van Neuter as the chef, but that wouldn't happen for many reasons. I just see him as being talk-show-friendly. hehe

 

[Mupp]

You know, I really don't know why some people have a problem with Angelo's desgin...

The Swedish Chef doesn't have eyes either!

And sure, Angelo does have a rather simple desgin, but so what? He's got a muppet nose. Besides, there were several characters that appeared on "The Muppet Show" that had very simple designs. Its all due to the very cost-effective idea of what-nots.
I don't see anything wrong with Angelo's desgin.

And his personality is fun and he has a sense of humor.

 

[frogboy4]

You know, I really don't know why some people have a problem with Angelo's desgin...

The Swedish Chef doesn't have eyes either!

And sure, Angelo does have a rather simple desgin, but so what? He's got a muppet nose. Besides, there were several characters that appeared on "The Muppet Show" that had very simple designs. Its all due to the very cost-effective idea of what-nots.
I don't see anything wrong with Angelo's desgin.

And his personality is fun and he has a sense of humor.

Eyes would help because he' doesn't have an instant charm or a distinct shtick to connect him with an audience like the other eyeless Muppets like the wildly inviting Swedish Chef or funky Floyd. Neither required much screentime or introduction for audiences to understand and embrace them. I could list many reasons why I think his design or personality dips below the quality we've come to expect from the Muppets, but in the end it comes down to the fact that Angelo seems blah to me in all areas. I don't see him winning over the casual fan, but I'm glad somebody likes him. I don't think he'll ruin the brand or anything. I just hoped for something better.

The one character I've liked that others might not is the early bird. He made me giggle. I wasn't expecting him.

 

[Convincing John]

I haven't seen all of the clips yet, but here's my two cents.

The funniest thing I've seen so far is the Bunsen and Beaker Frankenstein parody. I also liked the Bear on Patrol sketch and Pepe knowing he's in front of a green screen.

But these are the Muppets I know and love. Cat and Angelo...uh, well...as one of my heroes said of an act that went all wrong: "I liked what they were trying to do."

Some celebrities (or chefs in this case) work well with the Muppets. Some don't. We even saw this back in the Muppet Show days. We knew which guest stars were having a ball and which ones were acting like Cat does.

When you think of well-known chefs that have their own cooking shows, who do you think of? Well, there's Martha Stewart. You know something? If someone at her company said to Frank Oz, "We'd like for Cookie Monster to be Martha's co-host from now on. We'll pay you big bucks! Sign here." I'd be so happy. That guest spot was pure gold and Martha sure reacted to him, didn't she? She was so mad, she was about three seconds away from having steam whistling out her ears! I'd tune in every day to see Cookie Monster or Swedish Chef creating havoc in Martha's pristine kitchen!

Another idea for a host might be Emeril. He worked once with Elmo on a home video (forget which one), but from what I remember, he didn't seem to have any trouble interacting with him. Again, imagine him saying "BAM!" while adding some ingredient and Animal imitating him by smashing fruit with a mallet Gallagher style. (You could even have Marvin Suggs do that in a cameo).

I also saw Kermit on Paula Deen once. Steve was great with the ad-libs, but I could see Fozzie being the assistant for her. Fozzie would be all nervous things wouldn't go right and Deen, being the grandmotherly lady that she is, would gently help him out. Statler and waldorf could make appearances to both heckle Fozzie and hit on Deen.

I don't know jack squat about cooking, so those are the only cooking shows I can think of right now. Cat is just...there. She's...okay, but she's about on the same level as Donna (from Donna's Day) with the Swedish Chef. Angelo doesn't really work for me. He's just...there, too. It seems like he was just created on the fly and they tried too hard to create a new character that looks too general compared to the rest, plus they shoehorn that character into a part that could have been filled by one with more familiarity to both hardcore and casual fans. (I feel the same way about Murray on Sesame Street).

An idea occured to me as a perfect co-host for this series. Why not Rowlf? I just watched "Dog City" and with some practice and studying Jim's work, Bill could do some great Rowlf performances. Would you watch Rowlf make bad puns and at the same time be helpful and caring like Rowlf always is? I would! He's got live hands so he could at least pick up and move some ingredients. He's a great character and we love him. Why not use him? He got the shaft in "Muppets Wizard of Oz". He was the perfect (and obvious) choice for Toto and they passed him by. If Muppeteers are trying to bring back Jim's characters, this would be a great way for Bill to work more on Rowlf and bring him more into the spotlight. If they did that, people would remember him when the movie comes out next year. With the right writing and exposure, moviegoers would see the movie next year and say "Hey, he's that funny Muppet dog from those cooking videos I saw online!"

The creators of this show probably thought "Well, we need a chef, but one the audience would learn from and speak articulately." So why not give Rowlf a chef's hat and let him go at it? He was a great co-host on the Jimmy Dean Show, so why not here?

Convincing John

 

[Luke]

You know, I really don't know why some people have a problem with Angelo's desgin...

Here's why. The Muppets are all these beautiful puppets, some with some really complex details, others a little simpler, but always with a big personality behind them. Angelo, is far far more basic, and completely different to the others - yet they have put him with them, and up front as the main character. If it was just him and Cat you probably wouldn't notice it as much, but the way they have done it makes him look the odd one out, and to make matters worse, he's got a cute personality but it isn't the biggest so the other Muppets outshine and upstage him easily. Same problem they had with Clifford!

I doubt it's economics why they didn't develop a more "Muppety" puppet, after all Henson built Red Fraggle for just appearances and Disney have far more budget. It looks more like they just needed a character and came up with Angelo quickly, unless of course it's to cross promote this puppet style as i guess kids could walk into FAO Schwartz and make themselves their own Angelo quite easily which is a good thing about him.

I really do think the main thing with Angelo though is it was just wrong to bring in another Chef. The kids are only just being re-introduced to the Muppets with this, the muppets.com skits, Studio DC and TV Movies. Doesn't make sense to introduce a new Chef when they have only just met the first, no matter what the requirements of a small web project.

 

[Drtooth]

The more I think about it...

I really don't think the Swedish Chef would work quite as well in the situation as everyone thinks he would. Here's why. Considering this IS in fact an informative show, we need to get the information out. And the Chef isn't funny because he talks gibberish in a cartoony generalization of a country's accent, but rather that he takes things too literally (Chicken in a Basket, Chocolate Moose), his recipes go horribly awry, or whatever he's making comes to life (if it wasn't alive already) and wants to attack him. I really don't see any of that happening here if he were the co-chef. All I can see is a watered down version of his routine, handing Cora the wrong instruments, trying to put too much of something into something... all eliciting a highly forced "Ha ha ha! No, that's not it" type of response. All the while, he'd basically sit by and nod, mutter in agreement, and maybe mutter aside to the camera. Not really funny now is it?

No. It shouldn't be the Chef... shouldn't even be Angelo (I guess they needed the live hands). It should be co hosted rather by this guy -> . Think about it. I could clearly see Kermit and Cat being friendly to each other, sooner or later getting Piggy jealous. Piggy would start screwing everything up out of anger. That's what I really liked about their relationship dynamic. Kermit's no more or less friendly to the guests, but Piggy misconstrues those as feelings (though she perfectly well can hit on any of the male guests). She then seems deadset on teaching the female guest a thing or two, but in the process she winds up having a nice chat with the guest, and they have more in common than they think. And Kermit is even MORE uncomfortable with them actually getting along fine.

Above all, I think the Problem with Muppets Cooking with Cat Cora is the Cooking with Cat Cora part. Somehow, I'd picture a Muppet cooking show more like this:

A celebrity guest chef drops by, and basically has a short segment with one of the Muppets (usually Kermit) at the opening (a mix between the wall and 10 seconds to curtain) where they talk about the recipe they're going to cook today. Theyn we get into the kitchen, and we have Angelo, but this time portrayed as a human chef, cooking someone else's recipe. Now, the difference is that Angelo is a very overly emotional, egotistical type of chef who following a series of events winds up having to host a show with the Muppets, because they're so desperate, they'll actually take him when no one else would. He actually can't stand being there (ala John Cleese in the final number) and he REALLY hates having various Muppets ruining his dishes by being his assistants. Things fall into the food, they get the recipe wrong, the classic schtick of putting too much yeast in. Whatever happens winds up being a disaster, with the end result always being that the celebrity chef already made another one. Angelo takes full credit and fakes pleasantries. And in case something were to go right, Gonzo would ask for an unreasonable request (pickles to go with a cake or something) causing Angelo to loose it.

 

[Convincing John]

Somehow, I'd picture a Muppet cooking show more like this:

A celebrity guest chef drops by, and basically has a short segment with one of the Muppets (usually Kermit) at the opening (a mix between the wall and 10 seconds to curtain) where they talk about the recipe they're going to cook today. Theyn we get into the kitchen, and we have Angelo, but this time portrayed as a human chef, cooking someone else's recipe. Now, the difference is that Angelo is a very overly emotional, egotistical type of chef who following a series of events winds up having to host a show with the Muppets, because they're so desperate, they'll actually take him when no one else would. He actually can't stand being there (ala John Cleese in the final number) and he REALLY hates having various Muppets ruining his dishes by being his assistants. Things fall into the food, they get the recipe wrong, the classic schtick of putting too much yeast in. Whatever happens winds up being a disaster, with the end result always being that the celebrity chef already made another one. Angelo takes full credit and fakes pleasantries. And in case something were to go right, Gonzo would ask for an unreasonable request (pickles to go with a cake or something) causing Angelo to loose it.

That sounds like an excellent idea for a Muppet cooking show. A story works so much better with Muppet-brand conflict like that. Guest stars not wanting to do stuff and the Muppets driving them crazy has worked wonderfully before. Muppets often excel at driving humans bananas by just being themselves (again, I reference the Cookie Monster appearance on Martha Stewart).

It would be great if Kermit could co-host the show. Still, what kind of a strain would that be on Steve's schedule if they needed him to play Ernie on Sesame Street? (Or do voice recording for Ernie toys or maybe a JHC project like a Wembley appearance alongside Red?) Maybe that's another reason that Rowlf would make a good co-host for something like this. There's nothing wrong at all with Kermit being co-host. It's an excellent idea. I'm just thinking about this possibility as far as schedules are concerned.

The idea of a dog cooking dinner is funny. (People still love seeing Snoopy make a Thanksgiving meal from toast, popcorn, pretzels and jellybeans). Sure, Rowlf would make some bad jokes during the show, but we know he's sensible and we can trust him not to mess things up. Rowlf's also got live hands, which would come in handy. Get it? (rimshot).

Convincing John

 

[Luke]

I don't think schedules would be a problem since these are filmed in a block and Steve was there for Rizzo anyway. I think Kermit would have been a great host if the Swedish Chef didn't work out. Kids should be seeing that he is the leader of the Muppet gang.

 

[Drtooth]

As for the Swedish Chef, he CAN fit into the current format, if they just change the run time. When it comes down to it, I REALLY hate the 5 minutes, commercial (that completely ruins the loading of the episode online anyway), and one more minute... adding an extra minute near the end would help the flow and give us more to look forward to after seeing the same Honda ad over and over.

By which, the chef could counter-intuitively fit OUTSIDE the program. Just before the Pepe closing, we'd see the Chef (watching on a laptop in the kitchen) attempt to make the same dishes, only with more disastrous results.

Overall, I think the biggest problem is that they filmed so many of these at once, and didn't really have the time for things to fully bloom.