"The Muppets" isn't the Muppets

[newsmanfan]

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Well, those Muppafans I have spoken to about the film IRL (including the ones I have had the honor of introducing the film to, loaning out my dvd!) were universally happy with the film and agreed with my assessments that the film was old-school Muppets, but with actual character development.

I personally was thrilled that the writers/Muppateers chose to address some realistic issues, looking at Muppets put into emotionally troubling circumstances. Of course, it being the Muppets, happy endings all around...but I loved how they arrived there. Just the RIGHT amount of change, I'd say.
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[MrBloogarFoobly]

I will say that, regardless of how amazing Steve Whitmire is as a performer, the writers have never really "gotten" Kermit's personality down post-Henson. He has turned into a nice, kind of bland, innocent, friendly frog who helps everyone with their problems. Kind of an Arnold from HEY ARNOLD! really. Henson's Kermit could be mischievous, sarcastic, and, on occasion, a little mean.

Whitmire is great as Kermit, but he's better when he's doing interviews with him. In my opinion, anyway.

 

[CensoredAlso]

And yes, they have to evolve somewhat.

The problem with obsessing over making a franchise "modern" is that what is "modern" today will very quickly be yesterday's news and your franchise will just end up looking embarrassingly dated because its priorities were skewed. Or worse, they'll look like a middle aged dad desperately trying to appear 20. The quality of the writing should take precedent over whether something appears "modern" enough.

In any case worrying about being "modern" is neither evolving nor changing. It's just pandering.

I will say that, regardless of how amazing Steve Whitmire is as a performer, the writers have never really "gotten" Kermit's personality down post-Henson. He has turned into a nice, kind of bland, innocent, friendly frog who helps everyone with their problems. Kind of an Arnold from HEY ARNOLD! really. Henson's Kermit could be mischievous, sarcastic, and, on occasion, a little mean.

Same thing that happened to Mickey Mouse and Bugs Bunny really. Just a bland mascot.

 

[bandit]

The problem with obsessing over making a franchise "modern" is that what is "modern" today will very quickly be yesterday's news and your franchise will just end up looking embarrassingly dated because its priorities were skewed. Or worse, they'll look like a middle aged dad desperately trying to appear 20. The quality of the writing should take precedent over whether something appears "modern" enough.

I agree! That's why it's important that they stay the same at their core. You wouldn't want to mess about with formula too much. When I say evolve, I mean that you want the characters to experience some growth.
As for keeping them relevant to the times, you needn't drag Snooki into this. *laughs* You can still keep to the same tone as previous Muppet/celebrity or pop culture gags. Still, the inclusions of....say DISCO in our age probably would be a little different than if it happened in a 70's production.That's all I mean. Keep it current...but keep it 100% Muppet, the Henson way.
Do you see what I mean?

 

[CensoredAlso]

Do you see what I mean?

I do, I just think they haven't see what you meant in the past few years. The Muppets (2011) did do it a little better of course but the balance between plot and humor was a bit off. But that's certainly a preferable problem to the ones the previous films had, hehe.

 

[bandit]

Ahh yes. Well, I have to admit that I have only seen Muppets 2011. I bypassed the previous ones. *lol* I'm only now playing catch up though.....by all accounts it's sort of a 'don't bother' feel to the endeavor.

 

[DannyRWW]

I don't think Kermit has become bland...but I do feel he has gotten a little too serious....but he seems to be played as the leading man/everyman type...like a cary Grant or Jimmy Stewart type (not that Kermit ever played any parts similar to Jimmy stewart in its a wonderful life or anything ) Mickey and Bugs on the other hand ...

 

[Drtooth]

I don't think Kermit has become bland...but I do feel he has gotten a little too serious....but he seems to be played as the leading man/everyman type...like a cary Grant or Jimmy Stewart type (not that Kermit ever played any parts similar to Jimmy stewart in its a wonderful life or anything ) Mickey and Bugs on the other hand ...

It's the writing. I really didn't find Kermit that bland except for (again) MFS, where the movie was all about Gonzo anyway... just... Kermit was there for marketing reasons... but for my taste, Kermit really became the Kermit we know and love in VMX, when he had multiple breakdowns and yelled at everyone, and blew a fuse numerous times. Something Kermit's been doing since forever. The Wonderful World of T-Shirts, The Muppet Show... how about that TMS skit where he tells everyone to "knock it off," then "knock it off with the knocking it off," and finally... "KNOCK IT OF!!!"

But Kermit is hard to really get a handle on writing. He's the relatively sane one, but that doesn't mean he's always a straight man... he's soft and warm as a character, but that doesn't mean he's always mild mannered... he's very complex, and sometimes the simplest characters are the most complex to capture. Meanwhile, anyone can make a Swedish Chef gag work. He doesn't need that much to be funny, and he's not all that complex. Just have him get attacked by whatever he's cooking, and you got a Swedish Chef skit.

Kermit was more Kermit in TM than he was MCC and MTI... certainly more Kermit than MFS. But then again, I find MCC and MTI did a meh job on other characters, as I said. Fozzie was en route to becoming an idiot character in MTI.

 

[CensoredAlso]

Kermit really became the Kermit we know and love in VMX

I'm glad that was true for others. For me, I had Kermit nightmares after seeing VMX. And not because the movie was deeper or darker or anything, it was just disturbing. Not in an artistic way, just in a disturbing way, lol.

 

[Pinkflower7783]

Whatever may have went wrong in the past I'm just glad the Kermit that I grew up and loved as a kid finally has his spunk back!