The Muppets 2011 vs Very Muppet Christmas Movie

[beaker]

Other than MFC(a tradition of seeing it over Christmas for my family and I that goes back to the 1988 airing on ABC ) , Letters to Santa, the other holiday Muppet dvd I bust out is It's a Very Merry Muppet Christmas Movie, affectionately titled "VMX" by hardcore fans.

I initially praised this one ten years ago on here when it aired, as the film we had been waiting for given MFS seemed like such a disappointment. Rewatching it now, I can't help but love certain scenes but also cringe at other parks...some of it seems wholly erratic and out of place. Mostly I watch it for the theater performance scenes and the large amount of Muppet characters there(Boss men!)Unlike LTS, it features an insane amount of characters which is nice.

But it struck me as very apparent how close this film feels tone and flow wise to the new movie.

The surreal fantastical random moments(Grinch, Crocodile Hunter, etc) The plot with the theater and bittermen. The staging of the performances in the Muppet movie theater, as well as the rehearsals. Heck didn't they both have a cover of Smells Like Teen Spirit on the stage? Coulda sworn the Penguins were humming that song.

Anyone else get a strong VMX vibe from the new film, or even wonder if it's almost a remake?

I wonder if someone has thought up a list of similarities between TM and VMX?

 

[muppetlover123]

muppet wiki made one
http://muppet.wikia.com/wiki/Simila..._Merry_Muppet_Christmas_Movie_and_The_Muppets

 

[CensoredAlso]

One gave me nightmares, the other didn't. No comparison.

 

[Reevz1977]

One is pretty ****, the other is pretty ******* good!

 

[beaker]

Thanks for the wikia article! Wow they got pretty indepth there. Always grateful for that site.

Well it's funny, EVERYONE loved VMX when it aired in 2002, many calling it the Muppet event we had been waiting for. Now in retrospect it gets downed on in a similar way to MFS and KSY(tho I take it most fans reserve their true disgust for Oz)

 

[beaker]

Wow...just reread that article ( http://muppet.wikia.com/wiki/Simila..._Merry_Muppet_Christmas_Movie_and_The_Muppets )

That cannot be a mere coincidence of how similar the two movies are. It's almost like a remake of some sort. Did Segel and Stoler ever see VMX? Maybe that's why the new movie upon reflection isn't doing it for me...it's way too similar to the meh like VMX.

 

[CensoredAlso]

That cannot be a mere coincidence of how similar the two movies are.

I honestly don't think they are that similar. The bare bones plot is similar but it's also a plot that hundreds of movies have used. And beyond that I don't see any real significant similarities between the two films.

 

[Ruahnna]

I have to confess--I really like VMX. I liked it when it came out--I like it now. It just isn't Christmas for me unless I get to see that show. The year I couldn't find my DVD copy I went out to the thrift store and bought not one but TWO copies on VHS in case that happened again. It is perfect? No--but like every other muppet production I've ever seen, there are moments that I sit still and just stare at the screen in wonder.

The list of similarities between the two movies was pretty comprehensive, but I'm going to argue that they are different enough to not be (as we used to taunt my journalism professor) unnecessarily redundant, but maybe just necessarily redundant. Some things that we love about the muppet show were the things that happened again and again and again. A short list includes:

1. Gonzo blowing the trumpet at the end of The Muppet Show theme
2. Kermit being launched into arm-waving hysteria by--among other things--the chaos around him
3. The chaos around Kermit backstage
4. Miss Piggy being the grand diva--over the top, breath-taking, surprisingly vulnerable and insecure
5. Miss Piggy reaching her limit and hi-yahing whoever annoyed her into next week
6. Gonzo's weirdness--in new and surprising ways
7. Zoot's last note to TMS theme (Tell me you didn't wait for that each week.)
8. Getting ziffled (kippled) At The Dance
9. The Newsman predictably getting clobbered by whatever he reports
10. Muppet Labs going predictably awry
11. The final Statler and Waldorf zinger of the show--just before Zoot's solo note.
12. "Fifteen minutes to curtain"
13. Wocka wocka wocka (Need I say more?)
14. "...with our very special guest star...." (Apparently, there never were any normal guest stars
15. Sam the Eagle hoping for something cultural and being disappointed
16. Wayne and Wanda ending in disaster
17. Running gags, dancing cheeses and flying linguini

But I digress--another muppet tradition.

I don't think having two versions of the same TYPE of story is a problem if both stories bring something interesting to the table.

If I were going to say what I disliked the most about VMX, it would be that I think--honestly--that Kermit (not to mention Jim) would be at least mildly and probably very mortified to find a show that celebrated how awful everything would be without li'l ol' him. Jim and Kermit were both modest (sometimes to a fault) while always aggrandizing the talent and contributions of others. There was no one I can name who was a bigger encourager of the talent of others (this board is full of people who have felt--second and third and fourth-hand the radiant energy of his enthusiasm) while modestly assessing his own abilities. Think of Kermit from the TMM, and TMTM--he is confident in everyone else's abilities, but somewhat diffident about his own.

If I were going to say what I disliked the most about TM, it would have to be the part where Fozzie bumps into the sign and the numbers change. I'm pretty smart, and I thought I was watching closely--but that made no sense. An extremely close runner-up to that moment is listening to Kermit say (dare I say whine) to Piggy, "You make me hurt you." (Avoid responsibility much, Kerm?)

There is much to like in both stories, and--of course--those of you who know me from here AT ALL know that I like Kermit's final realization of his love and appreciation for Piggy.

(Heralde--you have said often that you dislike VMX. I usually find what you say and how you say it interesting, but I cannot imagine what you dislike so. Pray enlighten me, sweetie--you can "conversate" me instead of clogging up this thread if you prefer.)

 

[zoebell]

actually, i also picked up on that line, "you make me hurt you" in TM, being kind of jarring. just because that's the kind of thing that gets said in actual abusive relationships. seemed a little heavy to have him actually say something like that to her, even though i know they were going for "real" in that moment

 

[CensoredAlso]

but I'm going to argue that they are different enough to not be (as we used to taunt my journalism professor) unnecessarily redundant

That's very well put actually.

(Heralde--you have said often that you dislike VMX. I usually find what you say and how you say it interesting, but I cannot imagine what you dislike so. Pray enlighten me, sweetie--you can "conversate" me instead of clogging up this thread if you prefer.)

Aw thank you; you as well! Well for the fans' sakes I don't want to go into too much of a rant or anything, I'll just keep it simple. Forgive me for going all hippie but I just got a disturbing vibe from the whole thing (not kidding about the nightmares, heh). The things you said you liked about it, I was actually thinking that those are the things I love about The Muppet Show. But I didn't really feel any of that from VMX. That's all.