The Jim Henson Company Puppets to perform at the 2011 Grammys

Mike Quinn

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To cuss or not to cuss..... :wink: Muppet or not Muppet?

They all did a great job and the energy of the performance and number came across on the screen, which was nice. As there does seem to be some confusion, Muppets is a legal and trademarked entity owned by Disney. That means specifically Muppet Show characters and the TV shows and films made by them. Anything not made by Disney is legally and technically not a Muppet. That means Fraggles and Dark Crystal and no doubt Dog City, Storyteller, Sesame Street and more are most definitely NOT Muppets. Unfortunately due to grey areas it does lead to confusion like this. As far as the cussing goes, people are always a lot more outraged when it's a puppet, due to the expectation of a puppet being for kids. However if you look at the history of puppetry they have a long track record of being for adults more than kids. This was the Grammys and it was post 9pm where in the UK at least, cussing is allowed. It was very clear this was not a daytime kids show. There were many other occasions where audio had to be dropped during the show. When something slips out during and excited thank you speech I can understand it. My only question is as an artist, if you know it's going to be "bleeped" out on the broadcast, leaving a big cavernous audio hole, how is that serving and entertaining your public? It is more self serving than anything, but that's just me...... Otherwise, non- kid puppets should be allowed to do and say adult things if the piece requires it. Last night's performance was intended to be a non-kid piece. Last year I provided all the puppet sequences for a music video and several of them were doing adult things, at the director's and musician's request. Yes several people got offended but the majority enjoyed it. As the musician stated, it wasn't at anyone else's expense or mean spirited. For those who are not faint hearted, you can find it on YouTube if you search "Thomas Dolby The Toadlickers". Happy Monday puppet people :smile:
 

Gonzo's Hobbit

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I didn't know they were even Henson Company. I thought perhaps they were an independant group made for the artist or something. However, all I could think about was the Muppet Show Episode with Elton John.
 

Drtooth

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I think I saw someone from City Kids... some robot super hero looking dude playing a keyboard.

But who was thay creepy multicolored turkey Muppet playing the piano and singing? :eek:

(yeah, I know... I know... but if I didn't say it, someone else would).


Anything not made by Disney is legally and technically not a Muppet. That means Fraggles and Dark Crystal and no doubt Dog City, Storyteller, Sesame Street and more are most definitely NOT Muppets. Unfortunately due to grey areas it does lead to confusion like this.
But here's what's confusing. Sesame Street DOES still refer to them as "Muppets" and notes "Muppets Holding" or "Muppets Studios" in the end credits of the show, even today.

even Sesame Street's website credits them as "Muppets"
 

frogboy4

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I see that the "Muppets" did not perform at the Grammy show tonight, but they are Jim Henson "puppets". This fact would be oblivious to a child. All they see is the what looks like a "Muppet". The look is unmistakeable to a child. "Muppet" or "Puppet", to have Jim Henson's characters associated with such a VULGAR song is unbelievable! I don't care how the music industry has dressed-up this song for airplay, it still contains a word in it's original lyrics that is horrible for a high school student to utter, not to mention a child to have to hear! And don't come back here and say that they replaced the word with "forget"! Children these days are smart! With one click, they can get on the internet and find out! Shame on you, Henson "puppets"! Shame, shame, shame! Parents have depended on your "puppets" to teach their children life lessons and now this! Shame on you!
Jim Henson objected to being pigeonholed as a kids' performer and I think the Henson Company has given enough to the world by way of childrens' education and they deserve to act as creatively as they choose. Last night's performance was a huge win for any classic Henson fan. :attitude:
 

D'Snowth

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As there does seem to be some confusion, Muppets is a legal and trademarked entity owned by Disney. That means specifically Muppet Show characters and the TV shows and films made by them. Anything not made by Disney is legally and technically not a Muppet. That means Fraggles and Dark Crystal and no doubt Dog City, Storyteller, Sesame Street and more are most definitely NOT Muppets.
It doesn't matter, if they're Henson related, they're still Muppets. Like Drtooth said, the characters on SST ARE still refered to as Muppets, because they ARE Muppets. They come from Jim Henson's Creature Shop, as do just about ALL Henson-related puppets, whether they be owned by Disney, owned by Sesame Workshop, or still owned by JHC, they're Muppets, even if they can't legally be called that.
 

Drtooth

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I see that the "Muppets" did not perform at the Grammy show tonight, but they are Jim Henson "puppets". This fact would be oblivious to a child. All they see is the what looks like a "Muppet". The look is unmistakeable to a child. "Muppet" or "Puppet", to have Jim Henson's characters associated with such a VULGAR song is unbelievable! I don't care how the music industry has dressed-up this song for airplay, it still contains a word in it's original lyrics that is horrible for a high school student to utter, not to mention a child to have to hear! And don't come back here and say that they replaced the word with "forget"! Children these days are smart! With one click, they can get on the internet and find out! Shame on you, Henson "puppets"! Shame, shame, shame! Parents have depended on your "puppets" to teach their children life lessons and now this! Shame on you!
And the "You don't get the point award goes to..."

I could spend hours lambasting that. I don't want to seem unfriendly, but YOU DON"T GET THE POINT! This isn't some preschooly nonsense that teaches kids shapes or colors, this is a national performance for adults, and any kid out looking for trouble CLEARLY knows trouble exists. I know it, you know it, Frankenstine jr. and the impossibles know it.

I for one am SICK of people saying Puppetry and animation are for kids, and everything that fits into that category has to be cleaned up, neutered, and lobotomized so grouchy old farts don't complain that kids who aren't watching may be watching somehow somewhere sometime. Kids either don't know or don't care. And the one that know don't care.

At the risk of being offensive, Jim Henson's character of Sam the Eagle is specifically a mockery of that view point. Closed mindedness, artistic repression, all in the name of an imaginary state of "wholesomeness" that EVERYONE since the beginning of time thought there was. No matter what, music has ALWAYS been scruitinized by older people. In the 50's it was "rock" in the 30's it was jazz... all the way back to someone saying "Gregorian Chants are the devils music."

Let the Henson company do what they WANT to do. Jim would have been proud to have done something like this, and if anyone over there had any problems with it, they wouldn't.

Seriously, the point is completely and utterly missed once again.
 

Drtooth

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Really, people like that who do nothing but whine and censor everything think they're bleeding heroes... ooh we care so much about kids. Sure, we're not putting an end to gang violence, and tightening restrictions so child molesters can't become coaches, but we'll be darned (pardon the French) if we let kids see such horrifying displays of REALITY!
 

anytimepally

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Parents have depended on your "puppets" to teach their children life lessons and now this! Shame on you!
Your kids watch the Grammys for life lessons? Really? :confused:

As for the "Muppet" thing.. as far as the trademark goes, obviously that belongs to Disney, but a Muppet is not just an entity, a trademarked group of things. To me, it's first and foremost a style of puppet-making. There aren't other puppets that look quite like the Henson ones. So, artistically, they're still Muppets, regardless of who owns the trademark to call theirs Muppets. And, anyway, legally speaking, Disney isn't going to sue us for continuing to refer to them as Muppets.
 

Drtooth

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Your kids watch the Grammys for life lessons? Really? :confused:
That person is probably just lazy enough to do that. After all, TV should be heavily regulated so parents don't have to raise their kids... like snack foods and everything else besides sex offenders. :rolleyes:
 
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