Sesame Workshop Trying To Have It Both Ways(Bert/Ernie issue)

[beaker]

So, I've been realizing how duplicitous Sesame Workshop is. They continually release "OMG, Bert and Ernie are NOT representative of gays!" statements...

Sesame Workshop has aggressively tried to shut down the bert/ernie gay thing, issuing endless statements since the 90's(some compiled here)
http://muppet.wikia.com/wiki/Are_Ernie_and_Bert_gay?

But then what the heck is this?

These were all prominently displayed with "Lady Gaygay" and "Gay pride" shirts at hot topic last year.

2010, an "official tweet from Bert of Sesame Street"

"Ever notice how similar my hair is to Mr. T’s? The only difference is mine is a little more ‘mo,’ a little less ‘hawk.’"

Yeah, haha...wink wink.

Sorry Sesame, can't have it both ways. You can't cave into religious right wingers but then give wink and nods. Or maybe they can.

But THIS statement bugs the crap out of me:

"They are not gay, they are not straight, they are puppets,' says Sesame Workshop President and CEO Gary Knell. 'They don't exist below the waist.' "

Yes, because Scooter, Howard Tubman, etc are totally suppose to be straight
And Janice/Pepper, Kermit/Piggy, etc arent suppose to be straight couples?
It's baffling to see this "puppets representing gay people? Why I never! that's crazy talk" reaction.

 

[CensoredAlso]

"They are not gay, they are not straight, they are puppets,' says Sesame Workshop President and CEO Gary Knell. 'They don't exist below the waist.' "

Yeah that logic doesn't really work. Obviously Kermit and Piggy are puppets and manage to have a romantic relationship.

Still, I don't think Bert and Ernie are a couple. Mainly because I don't like the assumption that two guys can't possibly be close, affectionate friends. It's macho nonsense.

As far as the shirts, are they official Sesame Workshop merchandise?

 

[minor muppetz]

I don't see how not existing below the waist would prevent someone from having a sexuality. Besides, they do exist below the waist. Bert existed below the waist in the "Doin' the Pigeon" number, Ernie existed below the waist in "I Don't Want to Live on the Moon", "The Insects in Your Neighborhood", and "The Best Friends Blues". Not to mention they both existed below the waist in The Street We Live On and various storybooks, merchandise, and full-body walkaround appearances (Sesame Street Live, Sesame Place, etc.).

 

[Drtooth]

Yeah, haha...wink wink.

Sorry Sesame, can't have it both ways. You can't cave into religious right wingers but then give wink and nods. Or maybe they can.

I think they're just trying to cash in off a meme. I think Sega actually got Dr. Eggman to say "SnooPING AS usual, I see" in a game... he did it in the Archie comics

I'm anxiously waiting for a T-Shirt... but chances are, I'd have to make one myself.

Basically, this is a snide little aside to the whole "controversy" that evolved from drunk college guys making jokes about childhood favorites... all the way back when it wasn't such a labored, commercial thing. There's also a T-Shirt they only sold at Spencer that makes reference to the "Shaggy is a stoner" meme (it either said baked or something... I got the G-rated "slacker" version ONLY because it was cheaper).

However, I also noticed how adult Sesame Street T-shirts have been lately. I cannot find the picture, but one is a shirt with Elmo with a mustache and the caption "This might tickle." We ALL know what that means. Here's another...

Yeah... as subtle as the subtle sound of a kitchen dining set falling down a flight of stairs.

Then there's the shirts that force the Pmip/Gangsta thing on them...

Yeah... that's clearly NOT a Pimp hat.

The most offensive shirt though, is this...

Just for the reference to the most mind destroying fall of Western culture out there.

Seems Sesame Workshop has a sense of humor when it comes to T-shirt designs. So, I guess the shirts are subversively shoving the meme back in the faces of those they have to disprove it to. And if that's the case... I LOVE IT!

Not as much as the All your cookie are belong to us one, though.... I still have yet to actually see that one.

 

[CensoredAlso]

Basically, this is a snide little aside to the whole "controversy" that evolved from drunk college guys making jokes about childhood favorites....There's also a T-Shirt they only sold at Spencer that makes reference to the "Shaggy is a stoner" meme

Lol, yeah exactly.

However, I also noticed how adult Sesame Street T-shirts have been lately. I cannot find the picture, but one is a shirt with Elmo with a mustache and the caption "This might tickle." We ALL know what that means.

Oh dear God, lol.

 

[D'Snowth]

I have to admit that I'm guilty of buying some of these ghetto/bling-bling SST shirts myself... I don't care if they're official or not, I just like 'em... Cookie eating a cookie with his name in big, graffitti-style letters; Oscar wearing a big 'G' madalian around his neck; Count surrounding by a bunch of money with caption reading "Countin' My Stacks"; the gang minus Elmo with caption reading "I Was Raised On The Street", etc.

 

[beaker]

Yeah that logic doesn't really work. Obviously Kermit and Piggy are puppets and manage to have a romantic relationship.

Still, I don't think Bert and Ernie are a couple. Mainly because I don't like the assumption that two guys can't possibly be close, affectionate friends. It's macho nonsense.

As far as the shirts, are they official Sesame Workshop merchandise?

Well I do believe the performers when they say Bert and Ernie was conceived as a response to the Odd Couple paradigm. But the way they go out of their way to shoot down the rumors, when they know Bert and Ernie are a kind of adopted icon to many gay people is...I don't know...just odd. And then they(yep those are official) release all this Bert and Ernie rainbow merch with a wink and a nod. I just don't get it.

I've come to realize though, Bert and Ernie...like The Count, are not kids. Maybe in some kid's books they are shown as kids, but I've realized after three decades of watching them they are definitely at least in their 20's.

 

[beaker]

I admit, some of the official nostalgic kid's shirts go a bit too far. Like the new Ninja Turtles/April O'neil pizza one. That one is so far over the line. And the Elmo mustache one...whoah.

The thing though tooth, Bert/Ernie=gay is not some drunken frat boy/family guy meme. It's an important and inspiring wishful thinking sort of thing for many people. I don't think the Bert and Ernie rainbow shirts are all all a spoof on the meme. I think they are being marketed to gay and lesbian teens and college kids, and I am more than happy about that.

 

[CensoredAlso]

And then they(yep those are official) release all this Bert and Ernie rainbow merch with a wink and a nod. I just don't get it.

I think Dr. Tooth's right, those kinds of shirts are more intended for older people as a kind of ironic wink.

 

[Drtooth]

The thing though tooth, Bert/Ernie=gay is not some drunken frat boy/family guy meme. It's an important and inspiring wishful thinking sort of thing for many people. I don't think the Bert and Ernie rainbow shirts are all all a spoof on the meme. I think they are being marketed to gay and lesbian teens and college kids, and I am more than happy about that.

The drunken frat boys are how these things start... then some of these drunken frat boys become writers, and then they shove jokes about it into shows. Then they become mainstream. Like, the Scooby-Doo movie was FULL of all the things people said in the early 90's about the characters... Shaggy and Scooby are stoners, Velma's a lesbian, Fred and Daphne run off in the middle of the episode and boink... even Johnny Bravo had a nod to that one (and referenced the fact that Shaggy is clearly stolen off of Jughead).

The Ernie and Bert meme is an example of something that became incredibly mainstream. On the one hand, there's the positive aspect that the gay community can embrace these characters as their own, and celebrate the possibility that they are... but then there's the dark, seedy aspect of the religious hyper-right using it as fuel to say that the mainstream "liberal" media is using it to indoctrinate kids, then proceed to offer alternatives that do indeed indoctrinate kids.

Now, while the underlining concept of Ernie and Bert is basically the old school comedy duo (like Laruel and Hardy, who shared beds in certain pictures and no one said anything about it, and Abbot and Costello), mixed with Jim's classic pairing of a round guy and a thin guy (also a fun loving guy and an uptight guy), there is the interpretation that people can walk away with. If used positively, as I said, I have no problem with it at all. Kinda think it's funny though I'm waiting for the gay community to embrace Mr. 2 Bon Clay and Ivankof from One Piece (seriously, if I were, I'd SOOOOO cosplay Invankof at conventions)...

To me the problem lies in the fact that Ernie's a child and actually said he was six. Should we take that at face value, or say "that's just an aside", like Cookie Monster's name being Sid, Guy Smiley's name being Bernie Leaderkrantz or Scooter being part parrot?

Still, the dark side of my mind almost wants to think Ernie and Bert are brothers, and something terrible happened leading them to being alone as kids, Ernie feverishly embracing childish things to mask a serious depression/ repress a terrible memory and Bert having to be his care taker.