Jason Segel talks The Muppets and his inspiration

[beaker]

Oohh... Well, I can tell you for a fact they'd never EVER try to make a film like Oz again. You wouldn't eat something that made you very sick one time. The whole Oz project was rushed (even though the script, out of a bunch of GOOD ones, was made well before the Disney sale), and it grabbed too many demographics, and it failed at being edgy forgetting how they sort of succeeded in VMX. Plus, if they're going theatric with this release, they ain't cheaping out and making it look like a neon nightmare like Oz did. Oh, the stuff I could rant about Oz. And doing a classic retelling was pretty ill advised anyway (the dudes who do the comics managed to get it right, though).

It should be noted that HE went to Disney to get them to make this movie. And that's something I think is just grand.

Haha, dude we get it...you hate the Oz film Don't worry, I share your sentiments and then some. It seems MWOZ was kind of this project that had to be done, not out of any inspiration but more over an agreement. It kept being talked about, and then there it was. So finally it got released, and that was that. I saw it once on tv and never plan to see it again nor buy it(And Im usually the kind of person that buys any dvd Muppet related) I can't fault Disney for it, since it was in the works before the buyout. But you know, we have to expect stinkers here and there. Look at Disney. They went from the visionary Fantasia, Alice and Wonderland etc to a string of so-so duds in the 60's through early 80's.

 

[beaker]

Totally!

I think you're referring to Gigglesock, if I'm correct.

I too can't stand a lot of those Muppet-haters out there either. Gigglesock and many of his fellow Muppet-bashers are obviously extreme Disney traditionalists who have a freakish distaste for the Muppets and they like to think that it was a mistake for Disney acquire the Muppets, Marvel, etc., in addition to dissimissing them as "old", "tired", "worn-out", "extremely unpopular" and other extremely negative things.

They even go so far as to resort to the always-convenient, but rarely with merit, "Walt theoreticals", saying that "Walt never would've bought the Muppets, he would've created his own characters"; "Walt's spinning in his grave"; "The Muppets are old socks and need to go back into Jim Henson's sock drawer", "Nobody wants to see the Muppets in Disney ads--they want to see Mickey and other REAL Disney characters" and other ridiculous, disgusting trash like that.

And to make matters worse, they even enjoy pointing fingers by saying that the Muppets, Marvel and other acquired properties have been taking the spotlight away from Disney's own classic characters/creations and thus accuse Disney of neglecting characters/properties that they already own and have owned for many decades.

Well...Disney has NOT railroaded their classic characters out of the spotlight! They continue to recieve very frequent exposure along with the Muppets, who ARE part of the Disney family now, whether you like it or not.

There are even some Anonymous comments that have been posted on another blog called "Blue Sky Disney" (http://blueskydisney.blogspot.com/). I can't help but assume that one of the big Muppet-haters there is Jim Hill Media's Gigglesock entering comments as Anonymous.

I sure do wish that we could send the Muppet monsters after those haters to eat them alive or send to karate chop each and every one of them REALLY hard.


There, I finally got that off my chest. I feel a little bit better now.

Haters gonna hate! Thing is, with the very small minority of online Muppet haters, they have no sense of imagination or true magic. If you're a human being and you're not touched by the kind naive warmth and fun of Fozzie, or Kermit, or Gonzo or the fancy of Fraggle Rock or any of the Jim Henson creations...well there's something wrong with ya. Kids in war torn countries are being delighted by international/localized Sesame street, so these haters have no concept of the full scope of work.
I may be a tad bias, as the Muppets and Jim Henson have always been more of a religious tradition than simple fandom.

Thing is, these Muppet haters...why don't they point that cynicism toward the house of mouse? Um gee...destroying that which made Disney Disney(2d animation) Focusing most their energy on the tween crowd?

However, thanks to the Iger era, Disney is going through a massive revolutionary new era(Tron Legacy, Princess and the Frog, Up, Toy Story 3, etc) and Im pleased as punch the Muppets can be a part of it while retaining a completely separate legal and identity status.

 

[beaker]

As much as I don't support absolutes or blanket statements...I support this one. You are right!

If EVERY kid was raised on Sesame Street, Fraggle Rock or the Muppets or localized/foreign versions thereof...I'd wager we'd have no wars, conflicts and much less problems in the world.

 

[Drtooth]

Totally!

I think you're referring to Gigglesock, if I'm correct.

I too can't stand a lot of those Muppet-haters out there either. Gigglesock and many of his fellow Muppet-bashers are obviously extreme Disney traditionalists who have a freakish distaste for the Muppets and they like to think that it was a mistake for Disney acquire the Muppets, Marvel, etc., in addition to dissimissing them as "old", "tired", "worn-out", "extremely unpopular" and other extremely negative things.

Gah... isn't that the loser that kept posting his idiotic rants and had multiple accounts on this very message board. Really. There's a difference between not liking something or not getting something and going TO the fan base to whine like a broken record over and over.

We've had so many exactly like him in the past (if not the same guy over and over... again, LOSER! A true loser would be someone who's banned from a site and makes multiple accounts to get banned again)... AND goes on another site and uses the same rants. Difference is he apparently has a little loser following of his own (unless they're just multiple accounts of himself agreeing with himself... I wouldn't put it past him).

Now, if I can remember his "educated opinion" (I would SOOOO say something about that if it wasn't a family site. There's something to be said about that kind of ego), he absolutely worshiped the ground CGI walked on. he'd come back from all these HORRIBLE movies and say how great the CGI was (anyone who willfully saw any of the Santa Clause movies past the first in theater's doesn't have a right to an opinion on how crappy things are) and say how puppetry, an artform in its own right, was dated and everyone has to make look a like CGI nonsense that detracts from people who actually use it as a tool, not a device to sell tickets cheaply. Pixar films are always amazing... Dreamworks seems to be maturing now and making good films... but virtually everything else is noisy ugly junk. Alpha and Omega looks like someone puked on paper and someone said "Let's film that" (when, frankly, they just stole an idea Pixar had and rushed it out, causing Pixar to can it).

There's a difference between the garbage Giggleschmuck/Frogpoop/toadbutt or whatever nom de loser he took this week spouts and the average muppet "I grew out of it so I could watch MTV stunt shows and Jersey Shore" hater. he seems insanely bent on making sure they're destroyed. Almost to a dangerous obsession. He basically made life miserable for the fan base and he gets a rise out of that. Think of it this way. if we complain about his idiotic "Noo Skool iz da bess skool" ramblings, he wins. Sure, I spent the entire thing pulling him apart to the unhappy doof he is, but that's just so you'll know not to take that guy seriously.

Wow... I used loser a lot in that one, didn't I?

why don't they point that cynicism toward the house of mouse? Um gee...destroying that which made Disney Disney(2d animation) Focusing most their energy on the tween crowd?

That is WHY I was so anti-Disney in the first place. I'm still not happy with a lot of things... Mickey Mouse Clubhouse for one (We need a NEW House of Mouse/Mouseworks type project) and getting after specific younger demographics that changed their channels permanently... and almost abandoning their profitable TV animation projects. I LOVE Phineas and Ferb, but it shouldn't be the only thing they're doing. Fish Hooks looks like crap, though. But even I admit that things are getting slightly better.

 

[Mupp]

Alpha and Omega looks like someone puked on paper and someone said "Let's film that" (when, frankly, they just stole an idea Pixar had and rushed it out, causing Pixar to can it)

Yup. That sounds like Dreamworks alright.

Alpha and Omega looks way too predicable. I'm not surpised it did so poorly opening weekend.

I have to say, even though I'm not a big fan of Disney Channel, I'm glad that they have had some hits in the past.

I have also thought about it, and really, there were pop singers in Walt's day as well. Like Annette Funicello.
I've realized that not everything has to be my cup of tea.

Still, things are getting better. Everything has gotten better since Iger took over.

And Disney ha definitely not let its classic characters take the backseat to the Muppets.
A recent example would be Epic Mickey.

 

[frogboy4]

The icky-looking “Alpha and Omega” is not a DreamWorks project. It's from Crest Animation (formerly RichCrest Studios that produced “Swan Princess” and “The King and I”) and distributed by Lionsgate. Strangely enough, this is probably the final performance from film legend Dennis Hopper. Other than that I don’t see any value in it. It has such a straight-to-video look.

DreamWorks has had some misses ("Bee Movie", "Shark Tale"), but it's also created some fantastic non-Shrek movies too like "How to Train Your Dragon" and the stunningly gorgeous "Kung Fu Panda". DreamWorks initiated its animation division by partnering with PDI (the organization that in fact teamed up with Jim Henson to create Waldo C. Graphic) that was later absorbed into the DreamWorks banner. I wouldn't -pigeonhole DreamWorks as something substandard. Just my two cents. They do have a great track record.

Disney does seem to be back on track and not spewing out those unsightly sequels to their prized properties. The Little Mermaid ones particularly upset me and looked so poorly drawn. It’s reassuring that they seem much more protective over their properties now and that includes the Muppets too. I was looking forward to the Muppets Halloween special, but I’ll believe them if they don’t think that project’s ready yet. I’m very excited about this new Muppet film and keep imagining that the cast and crew is scrambling around in pre-production right now, getting ready for the shoot in the coming days.

 

[Drtooth]

The point I am trying to make, and I hop it comes across is that that very poster with the obsessively nasty, fanbase insulting comments pretty much has nothing but "educated" things to say about new shiny flashies being all so much more important because they are new. You can replicate a Leonardo painting digitally with a 12th of the effort. And frankly, i get a LOT more out of Kermit and company being wired to ride bikes than I do with wooden actors looking more wooden next to jumping bouncy cartoon figures in Star Wars movies. His point is to make these things dated because they aren't CGI all the while basically saying "NNneh! I hate the fanbase! They be so mean to me" when he basically came over here and bullied everybody until the requests for banning piled up. Than, he obsessively created another account and another... multiple accounts are frowned upon on ANY web discussion group. That speaks of a very unhealthy and dreadfully unhappy person, if you ask me.

The icky-looking “Alpha and Omega” is not a DreamWorks project. It's from Crest Animation (formerly RichCrest Studios that produced “Swan Princess” and “The King and I”) and distributed by Lionsgate. Strangely enough, this is probably the final performance from film legend Dennis Hopper. Other than that I don’t see any value in it. It has such a straight-to-video look.

To quote Toughpigs... the movie was advertised at the beginning of the Jim Henson Lionsgate video. And all it did was to make Jim look even MORE like a brilliant visionary. Sure, there are some off brand CGI films that actually didn't suck. I actually liked Igor, though the candy coated ending seemed tacked on, and almost ruined the film's delightful dark spirit (the cast featured a rabbit who can never die who constantly committed suicide, played by Steve Bushemi... the only one who could pull such a thing off). And I really enjoyed Despicable Me though, it begged to be seen in 3-D (adding to a lot of obvious stuff that didn't need to be added), and I really think it needed a LITTLE more Mad Science and a little less family values. Overall, it made me so disappointed I couldn't go out and pick up a little minion at Burger King (they had Twilight for a kid's meal... What the WHAT?). Imagi had potential too, but it was mismanaged, and that lead to AstroBoy being less than it's potential (though i rather liked it) while TMNT managed to have the privilage of being made before ex-Dreamworks people ticked off all the writers.

That said, no way you'll get me to see ANYTHING by Sony. They have no business in the field. I saw about 10 minutes of Cloudy with a Chance of Meatballs at a Blockbuster, and I think I hate it more actually seeing that much. Not to mention what they've done to the Smurfs. Blue Sky has great animation, but their scripts are clearly unfinished, and leaving something missing out of all their movies (though I LOVED Robots)... they're ALSO a studio that stole the concept of Newt from Pixar, by the way. Not to mention all the lame CGI Fractured Fairy Tale Shrek wanna bes (including some even made by Henson). It's all over saturation.

Make no mistake, I like CGI as a form of animation. But everyone's doing it, using it too much, and it doesn't seem half as special. The one thing the Fantastic 4 movies did right was having the Thing be a guy in a suit. At least it looked grounded in reality, and not cartoonish like the Hulk in both versions did. And as I said, CGI characters that move more than wooden actors reacting to nothing make a movie seem hollow. You might as well do the whole THING in CGI. And who's to say that they can't use puppetry to aid CGI and vice versa. Say what you will about Where the Wild things Are, but you gotta admit, the monsters were a perfect symbiotic marriage of puppet suit and CGI facial features. I'd LOVE to see someone use that. Make a new TMNT movie live action with guys in suits and animate the faces.

 

[frogboy4]

I tend to ignore most other forum boards and posts. Just look at all the horrible Yahoo responses to find examples of mainstream America's ignorant and often bigoted ranting. It doesn’t take long for the Muppets to win people over so I don’t think a few bad apples posting garbage will spoil this new film. Frog! We need the Muppets now more than ever!

As far as animation goes, well, you know how particular I can be. Kung Fu Panda and How to Train Your Dragon didn’t just exceed my expectations – they were incredibly beautiful pieces that signaled to Pixar that they are indeed a worthy competitor. But some of the other companies out there keep shoveling computer-coated-cr*p at audiences without quality storytelling, art direction or such fine animation techniques. Just make a CG film, throw in some famous voices and have a flavor-of-the-month pop star lend a song to the soundtrack and presto!

I also think that practical effects are always the best – especially with Muppets. That’s a major contributing factor to their spark and magic. I’m not opposed to a little CG clean-up when necessary or even CG portions as long as it’s all done for the sake of a quality project and not a gimmicky marketing tactic. I think we agree on that. Forget the posts from silly people who don’t get that. I’m sure they also like to lick electrical outlets so the herd will be thinned soon enough.

 

[Drtooth]

I tend to ignore most other forum boards and posts. Just look at all the horrible Yahoo responses to find examples of mainstream America's ignorant and often bigoted ranting.

The internet is supposed to be about the free expression of free ideas. Too bad there just aren't any actual people with actual things to say giving them out. Being able to comment on stuff online leads to whiney bitter bigotry, stupidity, and worst of all "Wee! First Comment!" Anyone caught writing "First comment" on anything should be dealt with SEVERELY!

As far as animation goes, well, you know how particular I can be. Kung Fu Panda and How to Train Your Dragon didn’t just exceed my expectations – they were incredibly beautiful pieces that signaled to Pixar that they are indeed a worthy competitor. But some of the other companies out there keep shoveling computer-coated-cr*p at audiences without quality storytelling, art direction or such fine animation techniques. Just make a CG film, throw in some famous voices and have a flavor-of-the-month pop star lend a song to the soundtrack and presto!

This is exactly the same idiotic stunt pulled in the 90's when EVERYONE and their mother wanted to get the next Disney movie out there before anyone else did. So this isn't even new. Worst part, Don Bluth made some pretty shabby movies (Thumbellina... ugh) that weren't up to his once great 1980's classics. Not to mention the DREADful Tom and Jerry movie, which TOTALLY ripped off Oliver and Company and the Rescuers in a shallow attempt to be Disney. Oh well, at least we got the short lives "We've got to have... MONEYYYY" internet meme out of it.

My exact point is that when something's popular and everyone else does it, there's NO variety. Everything looks the same, and the ones that excel in their field never get the recognition they deserve. A LOT of people tried to make Sesame Street in the 70's. I'm really digging Letter people vids on Youtube (though the Puppets and puppetry needed SERIOUS help), but there was a lot of forgetable junk out there. Fast forward to today... everything is EXACTLY like Dora. And the ones that aren't stand out and manage to be something for standing out.

In a world of loud, tacky, kiddy junk with CGI stickers covering hack scripts, a Muppet movie would stand to be so different that it's a refreshing change of pace. Same with any 2-D film. People may just flock to it. Too bad Princess and the Frog had to contend with James Camoron's Titanic ego project. And a really poorly done sequel to a meh kid's film.

 

[Mupp]

The internet is supposed to be about the free expression of free ideas. Too bad there just aren't any actual people with actual things to say giving them out. Being able to comment on stuff online leads to whiney bitter bigotry, stupidity, and worst of all "Wee! First Comment!" Anyone caught writing "First comment" on anything should be dealt with SEVERELY!

Exactly!