Is Henson being sold?

[Luke]

Jamie

Ok well the way i saw the discussion was that Disney was getting slammed for releasing crappy sequels of things and treating even it's own stuff badly. I was more or less agreeing with that, saying that everyones at it anyway, and adding in another reason that wasn't being mentioned - that there aren't many other decent ideas around anyway so it's not just because they want to milk the cash cow. If you want to slam Disney (and i'm not saying you are wrong) you need to look at all the reasons behind something rather than just grabbing one and going with it.

Talking about the treatment of MTI Vs Peter Pan 2 we may get into some UK/USA problems here but from what i understand MTI was pretty well promoted here with a lavish party/premiere (Warrick and Michael went to it along with Frank Oz, Brian Henson etc), toy premiums, and plenty of TV exposure. Obviously i am a little blurry on what it was like in the states but i do have a lot of the TV appearances and promos on tape and it seemed like Disney was getting behind it though they did have something else out as well at the time. Obviously Peter Pan 2 got made a fuss off - they released it in a fairly quiet period for kids movies, it's 100% their own so they make more money, and they have places like Mc Donalds in their pocket so plenty of promotion there. While PP2 was promoted well though i don't think the promotion was as effective as MTI and at least over here, Peter Pan 2 was a total washout despite the promotion. I'm just saying that for a film that wasn't totally 'Disney', MTI didn't get a real bad deal from them.

I guess we are getting back to how people were saying that Disney doesn't respect or understand Henson but i actually think that things aren't as bad as people think. Yes Disney get upto all sorts but then all companies do - i guess the question is whether any other company would treat Henson any differently than Disney would - i really doubt it right now. Seeing as the Henson sale contracts don't (as far as i'm aware) give up total creative control you might find Disney treating Henson a little better than they do their own productions.

 

[frogboy4]

I was actually surprised how little promotion there was for MTI in the West Coast. There were a few 20 second spots and an appearance by Kermit on the Tonight Show, but on E (Entertainment Televison) they never ran the MTI preview - and they run any and everything they are sent. There were no bilboards or posters except for at theaters and no displays at that. I don't even rememver a public premier being reported. It was all very discouraging to me.

 

[Drtooth]

"We're in a sewer. Nothing beats the Magic of DIsney"--Gonzo (you can take this quote either way!) Buying copyrights is a dangerous game. It may have a positive effect, or a negitive one. Most companies just buy a copyright because it's there. Viacom bought the rights to all the Terrytoons cartoons, and except for a few Mighty Mouse Tees, they've disappeared. L'oreal cosmetics company once bought the rights to Filmation, and did nothing with it! On the flip side, Golden Books purchased the rights to Underdog cartoons, and released him on home video and DVD! But let's look at the facts. Disney owning Henson may have as many advantages as disadvantages. Back about '90, they started having Muppet attractions at their themeparks (one of the only things I'd die to do, I'd rather go to Universal and see Bullwinkle!). And in '93, videos came out by the dozens (Fraggles, Muppet Babies, Muppets, etc.). Plus they eased us in to the purchase with the Muppets at Disney World special (so much more watchable than any number of sitcoms go to Diseny!) I doubt they'd have a Muppets go to "Weird German Studio no one has heard about" special. (It'd go something like this, Kermit: Here we are at EMTV Studios. Fozzie: How can you tell? Kermit: I'm not sure. I don't even think any of the employees know what this is!) --------------------------------------------
But on the down side, let's face it, Disney may have a cutesy, sugar coated apperence, but deep down, they're an evil cutthroat business. They've no idea of what they are doing. They've given up catering to the mouse, and started cowtowing to the Bear (Winnie the Pooh, to be more exact). They'd over merchandise the stupidest things and the Muppets would be, in these times, left out in the cold. Look at the 102 Dalmations merchandising frenzie. It was a critically reviled movie, it flopped, and merchandise was shipped to a landfill just to get rid of it. Meanwhile, Emperor's New Groove was a Two thumbs up movie, and it was left out. Not to mention the fact that DIsney could find a way to butcher the Muppets or ruin them or something. (For some reason they bought the rights to Power Rangers! No kidding!) WHo knows what the new business will do?
So what ever side your on, just think that who ever buys it may, or may not use them.

 

[Fozzie Bear]

HERE HERE!!

I know somebody's gonna fuss at good ole Foz, but here goes:

2 things I complain about: Muppet Babies and Disney.

Muppet Babies cause I don't think they help the story at all (although Baby Fozzie is cute, he's really made to be dumber than usual).

Disney because I know that they will murder anything that is not originally Disney, which is evident since they murder their OWN stuff.

EM.TV was disastrous, and folks have said "They promoted such and such..." and I don't see where anything was helped by it.

But these are only my own opinions and not necessarily intended to be the sermon by which others may follow.

I think JHC has got a grasp of what they want to do now, and I think they're beginning to look "BACK" at what they've done, and we will see bigger better things from the Muppets. I'm still set in my decision that I think JHC should belong to the JHC and all will be well again...they can partner with other companies who don't necessarily have to own them.

I wish I had the money to buy JHC, and we'd all have some jobs there! LOL! But, JHC would be able to make their own decisions and carry out the ideals set forth by Jim the Man, not those ideals decided upon by Michael Eisner and Co.

But, that's only what I think.
FOZ

 

[Drtooth]

RIGHT ON, FOZZWOCKA!!!

 

[Patty]

I actually hope it all goes to Disney. I'm not a Disney fan by any stretch, but it is what Jim wanted. He said in late interviews that the muppets would live forever at Disney. He was no fool. He'd seen Disney's high times and low times.

Disney has put other properties above the mouse before and will gladly do so for love of money. Perhaps Disney would release some long-forgotten Muppet TV specials. Perhaps they'll open additional amusement park exhibits.

Say, shouldn't the Henson kids be able to buy the company back for what they received?

 

[frogboy4]

Half of what the Henson family received was in EMTV stock which is slightly more valueable than Enron stock - or at least the last time I checked.

 

[Luke]

Jamie

The Henson kids actually managed to get rid of their EMTV stock just before it really dropped massively. From what i've heard they made a big loss but narrowly avoided serious financial catastrophe. I don't think there is a member of the Henson family now with EMTV shares !

If the company was going for say 300 million they could probably be able to afford to buy it back, but i doubt they'd want to. They must have forseen big potential financial problems with the company to actually sell it - i think it's safe to say they didn't see things getting any better. They still make enough money out of Henson stuff and their own businesses - charging EMTV rent for the Henson studio's must bring in a few million.

 

[Fozzie Bear]

I think had Jim lived, the deal with Disney would have been okay as long as he was there to over-see it all; but I don't think he would have really REALLY wanted them to own the whole thing.

FOZ

 

[Luke]

I don't think Jim would have approved of the EMTV thing - they made all this crap up at the start about Haffa having a family business but i really don't think Jim would have wanted his company in German hands. The Muppets are kinda an American institution - i think if anyone it would have been Disney.