If you support Disney owning the Muppets...

[CensoredAlso]

Theproblem is there's a right way and a wrong way to make something adult.

Exactly, like I said, there's a difference between mature humor and immature humor. They are not the same thing.

As far as the character's evolving, of course they have changed in the past and there's nothing wrong with that in itself. However, another side of the argument is that characters, even deep characters, are not like real people. Sometimes the more they "grow" and change, the more they lose what made them work in the first place. Especially in comedy. Say a comedian gets a good reaction every night from the way he tells a joke. Then one night he decides to change it slightly because he's positive it will be better. But it often happens that the audience doesn't agree and doesn't laugh.

John Cleese once described this time when they were doing a live Monty Python show and the audience just didn't laugh. He decided, "that they were right and that it wasn't funny. And I'm being perfectly serious, if people aren't laughing it isn't funny...Comedy is extremely brittle."

Of course, there will always be some people who laugh, but will that be enough for the comedian to be able to continue? The band KISS has always had the attitude that if their fans don't enjoy an album, it's because it wasn't good enough. They don't blame the fans. Of course, you can't always go by the fans. But on the other hand, they made you what you are today.

 

[MelissaY1]

Exactly, like I said, there's a difference between mature humor and immature humor. They are not the same thing.

As far as the character's evolving, of course they have changed in the past and there's nothing wrong with that in itself. However, another side of the argument is that characters, even deep characters, are not like real people. Sometimes the more they "grow" and change, the more they lose what made them work in the first place. Especially in comedy. Say a comedian gets a good reaction every night from the way he tells a joke. Then one night he decides to change it slightly because he's positive it will be better. But it often happens that the audience doesn't agree and doesn't laugh.

John Cleese once described this time when they were doing a live Monty Python show and the audience just didn't laugh. He decided, "that they were right and that it wasn't funny. And I'm being perfectly serious, if people aren't laughing it isn't funny...Comedy is extremely brittle."

Of course, there will always be some people who laugh, but will that be enough for the comedian to be able to continue? The band KISS has always had the attitude that if their fans don't enjoy an album, it's because it wasn't good enough. They don't blame the fans. Of course, you can't always go by the fans. But on the other hand, they made you what you are today.

It's certainly a double edged sword. I remember reading an interview several years back with Matt Groenig and how he was saying one of the reasons he didn't age the Simpsons characters is because he thought it would take away from who the characters are and then they'd have to come up with scripts to show things they would go through as older characters. That's why the show has been on as long as it has: because the writing is STILL clever, hasn't totally gone the way of toilet humor (which I enjoy on the occasion but not constantly), and Maggie's still a baby, Homer doesn't look like his father yet, etc.

 

[TheJimHensonHour]

Let’s berak this’n down…

A) the Muppets (Jim’s Era) was and is geared for Adult humor innuendo. And, I enjoy this today in it’s current form. That’s what makes the current stuff watchable as an adult. Ask any parent who watches DVD’s over and over again.

B) The Hipness of Kermit has always been in question – I believe it may be over the top sometimes… but, I have to admit, even Jim tried to Hip out Kermit – I give you MTM when he busts into the agent/producers offices. That’s what makes it funny. We all see Kermit from different sides depending on how he was introduced to you - Sesame Street – the reporter version, serious but fun. The Muppet Show Kermit - was a stressed out producer. The Movie version and early Sesame always show his caring side. Even the VMXmas showed that. That is the Kermit that I know and love… I really enjoy the Modern version of Kermit – I like the edgy-ness of him. It’s a direction that shows his next evolution. Keeping him in a nice mid-ground of adult/child relations. What I don’t like is watching him do cheesy commercials like Pizza Hut, or the Ford commercial. I enjoy watching Kermit re-invent himself via Steve or whomever. I really enjoyed the Oddessy shorts where Floyd is Jamming and Kermit dances out his frustrations – Amphi-boogie-frog – That rawked and shows even serious caring people need to shed some stress. ( cont.)

That's the Kermit I know and love as well a well rounded frog hehe
But keep in mind that in MTM Jim was having Kermit act that way to act like a hollywood big shot.

Ah, see, EX Simpsons writers! Must've been a reason for them leaving There's still some decent shows on T.V. I don't watch them because I've pretty much given up on television but I would say stuff like "24" isn't exactly paper thin plots...

No it's just flat out over hyped rubish...

Can I say one thing? that's what's right with the new muppets. Pepe, Rizzo, and Gonzo. If they could only find a way to make the other characters this good, we'd be onto something. Even MOZ was a little better because of Pepe!

I couldn't agree more! But I also miss old wacky wierdo performance art gonzo he's so calm now.

 

[Drtooth]

I couldn't agree more! But I also miss old wacky wierdo performance art gonzo he's so calm now.

Once again, just like Steve Martin. The one good thing about MOZ was they were trying to get him back with Camella. Even though they threw in that "filled out" joke I didn't like.

 

[TheJimHensonHour]

Once again, just like Steve Martin. The one good thing about MOZ was they were trying to get him back with Camella. Even though they threw in that "filled out" joke I didn't like.

Exactly for me besides Pepe seeing Gonzo still in love with Camilla after all these years of not seeing her made me sooooo happy.

 

[Medbe Monster]

Ya Know, I don't think Disney owning the Muppets was such a good Idea in the first place,

Would it have been any different if Warner Bros. owned them?

 

[Drtooth]

Would it have been any different if Warner Bros. owned them?

Warner Brothers? The Genuiuses behind Loonatics Unleashed, a horrendous remake of Invasion of the Body Snatchers, and Baby looney Tunes amung others?

Disney almost sounds better by comparison. Almost.

I wonder what would happen if the Weinstein company in conjunction with Sesame Workshop were to get them. At the very least, we'd see Kermit on SS again.

 

[MelissaY1]

That's the Kermit I know and love as well a well rounded frog hehe
But keep in mind that in MTM Jim was having Kermit act that way to act like a hollywood big shot.

No it's just flat out over hyped rubish...

I couldn't agree more! But I also miss old wacky wierdo performance art gonzo he's so calm now.

Well society does eat up rubbish don't they?

 

[TheJimHensonHour]

Well society does eat up rubbish don't they?

mmhmm it's like I say "Sex no longer Sells Stupidity's on Sale Today"

 

[Drtooth]

Blame that on Andy Samburg.