Bert and Ernie Gay Rumor: Settled

[beaker]

Well, there is the old Beaker vs the new Beaker.

Aw, Beaker never had a thing for model women pre LTS?

Though, in the new Muppet youtube video...it almost seems like he's writing a love song for Bunsen.

 

[beaker]

Hee, yeah. I guess that's what I was getting at: there are male Muppets like Pepe and Rizzo who flirt with ladies all the time. Then Muppets like Fozzie don't do that but still swoon when lovely ladies are the guest stars. Scooter doesn't do either. He does, however, get excited when stars with gay followings are around.

Man, Pepe can be a quite a blue minded fella. The 2002 Fox show pitch tape, some of the hidden Pepe videos on From The Balcony and other rarely seen segments make it seem like Pepe is rather "adult" in his language and mind(I cant even reference what this one hidden video on from the balcony with pepe was about, heh) As much as I love Pepe, and consider him one of my top five favorite Muppets, his obsession over women can get a bit much. Fozzie seems much more innocent, though youre right he often gets tongue tied and awestruck around certain women.
With Animal its his schtick to be the womanizer, but I think I recall even Sam the Eagle at one point oogling a woman in some sketch. Rizzo of course seems like quite the rat player.

Now, there were a few Land of Gorch Muppet sketches on SNL that went way beyond the realm of mere innuendo, so the Muppets have a history of dipping into very adult realms(not including Puppet Up Uncensored) Point being, Im not sure why so many would take issue with Scooter or others being gay given the raving mad actions of some of the other characters and given Scooter's sexuality seems to be rather innocent.

Bert and Ernie...yeah thats an anomalie. As someone noted, only the clearly defined "grown up" monsters like Oscar, Count(boy, is he quite the player!), and parents of Muppet children are depicted as having romances. It's hard to imagine Bert and Ernie are suppose to be any younger than their mid teens, when thinking back at the wide breadth of their history since the late 1960's. As a side note, I dont get why there was such a controversy over Roosevelt Franklin, yet not over Lefty who is pretty much suppose to be a spoof of an inner city drug dealer.

As far as Beaker/Bunsen...notice the way the picture of Bunsen is framed in the shot during the new Beaker video

 

[beaker]

And, I don't mean to be rude, but is this what this thread is really about? I thought it was about debunking speculations, not promoting them.

Well, why is this any more harmful than fan pairing threads wanting to see Gobo and Red get together, Boober and Mokey get together, etc. Heck its been established that Floyd and Janice have quite the not so innocent relationship. People are simply speculating on the factual nature of which various characters are suppose to be representing.

People say "oh, they're just Muppets, they aren't meant to be based in the real world". But we know Statler and Waldorf are a satire of elderly white males. We know Roosevelt Franklin and Clifford are meant to be black characters. We know Rosita and Ovejita are hispanic. And it's in this rich cultural tableaux of Muppetyness that all diversity is celebrated.

 

[beaker]

Scooter that hasn't been done already for the same reasons that I wouldn't want him to become a lady's man like Pepe. Scooter works great as is.

Scooter's issue is that he was pretty much sidelined with Rowlf(both considered to be 2 of the top Muppet Show characters)
from 1990 until more recently. Thankfully, as of LTS and BoRhap he's been allowed to come back into the spotlight a little more. But he's been noticeably MIA for a lonnnnng time

Just posted the scan of CTW's official statement in my fan blog, if that's OK with you...

http://sesamestreetblockparty.blogspot.com/2010/02/bert-and-ernie-rumor-officially.html

That's funny, because how does SW account for THIS newer Bert and Ernie shirt being sold at the mall?
http://www.hottopic.com/hottopic/Apparel/TShirts/Sesame-Street-Bert-And-Ernie-Rainbow-Tee-263784.jsp

Unless, that's an unauthorized shirt upon which SW should sue

 

[Super Scooter]

Well, why is this any more harmful than fan pairing threads wanting to see Gobo and Red get together, Boober and Mokey get together, etc. Heck its been established that Floyd and Janice have quite the not so innocent relationship. People are simply speculating on the factual nature of which various characters are suppose to be representing.

Gobo and Red's relationship is kinda hinted at in the show, though I think it would be a mistake to explore it further than they did on Fraggle Rock.

As for Boober and Mokey, yes, I would have a problem with that. No, it's not harmful, but it's silly and makes no sense. I suppose Mokey IS the only one who could love Boober, seeing as she's so sympathetic, so I'm wrong and it COULD make sense... but... where was I going with this?

Oh, yeah. I've never seen this Boober and Mokey discussion, but I would have a problem with their being paired up in a romantic way. Especially since they are definitely just kids.

 

[GonzoLeaper]

That's funny, because how does SW account for THIS newer Bert and Ernie shirt being sold at the mall?
http://www.hottopic.com/hottopic/App...Tee-263784.jsp

Unless, that's an unauthorized shirt upon which SW should sue

First off, it may well be an unauthorized shirt. I can certainly believe that. If it's not, or even it is, I still believe that shirt is as gay as you want it to be. Sometimes a rose is just a rose.
It can be just two best friends and a rainbow, symbolizing the sunny days that are enjoyed on Sesame Street.

I guess it's nice to see a letter from Sesame Workshop addressing the Bert and Ernie rumor and all, but honestly there's no need to keep berating this issue. It's been officially stated for the record, so no one will keep wondering, that Bert and Ernie are not gay.
Why is the concept of best friends and roommates so hard to understand? They are most certainly a great pastiche of Felix and Oscar from The Odd Couple. That's a perfect example.
Plenty of guys in colleges all across the world room together in dorms and plenty of guys continue to room together in apartments after college before they get married. There's nothing weird about it and no need to speculate.
I like how Sesame Street explained their educational purposes for Ernie and Bert- they're a great example of how people can get along despite their differences. This is a good picture of what tolerance should look like really- being able to accept that people believe different things and in fact, are different in their own ways- and though you may not necessarily agree with their beliefs or choices, you can still accept them as a person and listen to them out of respect and love for all. (Because we should love and respect everyone- we're all made in God's image and that's reason enough. And we should certainly do as Jesus told us in Luke 6:31 and "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.") It's being able to accept that Ernie likes to be loud and noisy and kinda wild and crazy and Bert likes to be quiet and peaceful and a bit straight-laced- but both of them can accept that about each other and still like each other's company because they're best friends.
I think their "But I Like You" and "That's What Friends Are For" songs sum it up best.
"I don't like any of those things- but I like you."
"I don't mind if you like .....- that's what friends are for."

 

[RedPiggy]

Gobo and Red's relationship is kinda hinted at in the show, though I think it would be a mistake to explore it further than they did on Fraggle Rock.

As for Boober and Mokey, yes, I would have a problem with that. No, it's not harmful, but it's silly and makes no sense. I suppose Mokey IS the only one who could love Boober, seeing as she's so sympathetic, so I'm wrong and it COULD make sense... but... where was I going with this?

Oh, yeah. I've never seen this Boober and Mokey discussion, but I would have a problem with their being paired up in a romantic way. Especially since they are definitely just kids.

It's not like Gobo+Red was canon and Mokey+Boober wasn't. Outside of a few flings with Tosh, Boober worshipped the ground Mokey walked on.

Fraggles have even more of an ageless quality than the other Muppets. You can't really argue height is a hint, you can't argue personality ... basically, you narrow it down to "has no gray hair, has a little, and has a lot". The rare times you see Fraggle babies, they are with their parents/guardians. A lot of the Fraggles we're used to seeing clearly don't live with their parents/guardians. Even Gobo argued with Matt that he wasn't a kid anymore, which at the very least is what a teenager would say.

I have to wonder, after being highly amused by this thread, whether the TYPES of relationships don't bug people nearly as much as the idea of HAVING relationships. While a lot of us got around to "I don't care what Ernie and Bert are", when someone like Scooter is mentioned, we instantly return to "Uh-huh, nuh-uh" type snipping. So, I posit that it really isn't the type of relationship that gets under people's skin, but the idea of some characters having relationships at all. I mean, I've stopped wanting romance, but I'm not going to deny it to characters.

 

[frogboy4]

First off, it may well be an unauthorized shirt. I can certainly believe that. If it's not, or even it is, I still believe that shirt is as gay as you want it to be. Sometimes a rose is just a rose.
It can be just two best friends and a rainbow, symbolizing the sunny days that are enjoyed on Sesame Street.

I guess it's nice to see a letter from Sesame Workshop addressing the Bert and Ernie rumor and all, but honestly there's no need to keep berating this issue. It's been officially stated for the record, so no one will keep wondering, that Bert and Ernie are not gay.
Why is the concept of best friends and roommates so hard to understand? They are most certainly a great pastiche of Felix and Oscar from The Odd Couple. That's a perfect example.
Plenty of guys in colleges all across the world room together in dorms and plenty of guys continue to room together in apartments after college before they get married. There's nothing weird about it and no need to speculate.
I like how Sesame Street explained their educational purposes for Ernie and Bert- they're a great example of how people can get along despite their differences. This is a good picture of what tolerance should look like really- being able to accept that people believe different things and in fact, are different in their own ways- and though you may not necessarily agree with their beliefs or choices, you can still accept them as a person and listen to them out of respect and love for all. (Because we should love and respect everyone- we're all made in God's image and that's reason enough. And we should certainly do as Jesus told us in Luke 6:31 and "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.") It's being able to accept that Ernie likes to be loud and noisy and kinda wild and crazy and Bert likes to be quiet and peaceful and a bit straight-laced- but both of them can accept that about each other and still like each other's company because they're best friends.
I think their "But I Like You" and "That's What Friends Are For" songs sum it up best.
"I don't like any of those things- but I like you."
"I don't mind if you like .....- that's what friends are for."

It has been stated on this thread that the tee-shirt is official merchandise. It seems pretty gay to me and I've seen similar official types of cheeky designs in San Francisco stores. There's a definite product strategy from SW.

I agree that the Muppets mean many things to many people. Why is it so scary to you that the characters *could* have gay roots behind their design? The Muppets have always been made up of a lot of people from various walks of life. It's been noted that even Oz has made off-the-cuff hints that the characters could be life partners while SW's official statement contradicts that. Who cares? People see in Muppets what they want to see. That is their design and function. They are what you want them to be.

I like the lesson of respect and tolerance from the Muppets and in that spirit I will ask you to please post your Bible talk in the appropriate section. There are plenty such threads at Muppet Central, but this really isn't the place. This very thing has been discussed many, many times before. If I hadn't already made the choice that that particular religion is not for me I would definitely find it off-putting from these types of posts. Most Christians I know are nice folk who don't feel the need for constant scripture recitation. If you're trying to indoctrinate people into your religion this might not be the best way. It's great to share your religious point of view, even here, but when you pull out the "good book" it becomes something else entirely. Something oppressive and judgmental rather than something shared. Thanks.

 

[Alpha Centauri]

It has been stated on this thread that the tee-shirt is official merchandise. It seems pretty gay to me and I've seen similar official types of cheeky designs in San Francisco stores. There's a definite product strategy from SW.

I agree that the Muppets mean many things to many people. Why is it so scary to you that the characters *could* have gay roots behind their design? The Muppets have always been made up of a lot of people from various walks of life. It's been noted that even Oz has made off-the-cuff hints that the characters could be life partners while SW's official statement contradicts that. Who cares? People see in Muppets what they want to see. That is their design and function. They are what you want them to be.

I like the lesson of respect and tolerance from the Muppets and in that spirit I will ask you to please post your Bible talk in the appropriate section. There are plenty such threads at Muppet Central, but this really isn't the place. This very thing has been discussed many, many times before. If I hadn't already made the choice that that particular religion is not for me I would definitely find it off-putting from these types of posts. Most Christians I know are nice folk who don't feel the need for constant scripture recitation. If you're trying to indoctrinate people into your religion this might not be the best way. It's great to share your religious point of view, even here, but when you pull out the "good book" it becomes something else entirely. Something oppressive and judgmental rather than something shared. Thanks.

Well put.

 

[Fozzie Bear]

Reminder to all to be respectful of opinions. Don't be offensive if sharing your opinion, and don't be offended by opinions. Everyone is going to think about things as they fit their lives and that's a welcome thing!

First and foremost, this is just a conversation; but the most important thing is that we appreciate each other for who they are.