The Bible and Love and Christians

[Bannanasketch]

Yeah, that is what I'm trying to say. Also, heralde, you should start reading it more. There's really interesting stuff in there. And I've also noticed, that I can always keep growing in my relationship with Christ and I never get to a point when I'm satisfied with staying there. There's always room for improvement.

 

[CensoredAlso]

Also, heralde, you should start reading it more. There's really interesting stuff in there.

Lol, yeah I don't really have an excuse. You know I never really thought about it but I'm probably more used to reading about the Bible than actually reading the Bible itself, lol.

I don't regret that though, I think historical and spiritual analysis is important. Do you read about the Bible at all?

Tying it back to the topic , people point out that there's a lot of issues that Jesus did not specifically address (obviously like homosexuality), and therefore we can't know what his opinion was. But I think it's good that rather than have everything spoon fed, we're forced to analyze and use our heads to figure these things out.

Honestly, my opinion, things like sexual orientation are morally neutral things. They aren't what makes a person good or bad. Being attracted to men does not make me a good person. Or a bad person. One has nothing to do with the other. Jesus concentrated on how we should treat others, with selflessness and mercy, etc. That's also why he didn't talk politics. In the grand scheme of things, it wasn't important. What is important is just real human relationships.

 

[Bannanasketch]

I do think Jesus went a little more than just talking about how you should treat people. I mean, he did teach on that, but his message went beyond just that.

 

[CensoredAlso]

I do think Jesus went a little more than just talking about how you should treat people. I mean, he did teach on that, but his message went beyond just that.

Like what? Just asking : )

 

[Bannanasketch]

Well, he wanted people to follow him and make it all or nothing. He wants us to completely give up our life to him and give all of the glory to God no matter what we do. We must be so willing to follow him that we must love him even more than our family, even more than our life. He also said he is the only way to get into heaven. He loved us so much that he even died so we could have his grace and reconcile with God. I'll give you some verses to look up and you can decide your own opinions on it but I think it's pretty clear.

John 14:6
Matthew 16:24-25
Luke 14:26
John 8:31-32
Luke 14:33

Read these verses and see what you think.

 

[CensoredAlso]

I don't see any contradiction. He said the way to follow him was to follow his example on how to live, that's all. ; )

 

[frogboy4]

Here's another disturbing article about the treatment of gays by the Christian leadership in Ghana. What makes this troubling is that a lot of this activity is promoted and funded by prominent religious groups right here in the US. There's a Vanguard documentary on Hulu that discusses much of how that works. I wish we had a way to get a list of the offending US Christian groups supporting these atrocities so that their followers could hold them to task. America does have its faults on this issue, but not like this potential holocost-in-the-making to rid Ghana of gay people by any means necessary. Here's the transcription for those who don't press the link:

Paul Evans Aidoo: Arrest all homosexuals
The Western Regional Minister, Paul Evans Aidoo, has ordered the immediate arrest of all homosexuals in the region. He tasked the Bureau of National Investigations (BNI) and all security agencies to smoke out persons suspected to be engaging in homosexuality.

He also enlisted the services of landlords and tenants to provide reliable information which will lead to the arrest of homosexuals.

His directive follows months of campaign against the practice of homosexuality in the country.
The Christian Council of Ghana last Monday also condemned the growing incidence of homosexuality in the country after other religious bodies had taken to the streets in protest against the practice, urging Ghanaians not to vote for any politician who believes in the rights of homosexuals.

The Western Region has been a beehive of activities linked with homosexuality. A recent media report claimed the Western and Central regions together have a total of about 8,000 registered homosexuals and lesbians.

That report sparked a series of religious demonstrations, with the Muslim and Christian communities in the region hitting the streets to protest what they claim is an ungodly and demonic act.

In an interview with Joy FM, Mr. Aidoo condemned the practice but also contested the figure being bandied about in the media. Whilst conceding that the practice actually goes on in the region and in people’s closets, he said the 8,000 figure cannot be correct.

“I don’t believe it; nobody believes it,” he said, adding, “We do not see them; REGSEC does not see them.”

He accused the NGO alleged to have registered the gays and lesbians in the two regions of engaging in selfish practice.

Mr. Paul Aidoo minced no words at all in his dislike for the practice. He stated that “all efforts are being made to get rid of these people in the society.”

He said once they are arrested, they will be hauled before court to test the law which frowns on homosexuality in the country.

But a lawyer at the Kwame Nkrumah University of Science and Technology has challenged the legitimacy of the minister’s directive.

Ernest Kofi Abotsie told the station that no person can be arrested for breach of morality, explaining that the law on “unnatural canal knowledge” in the criminal code is still ambiguous and cannot necessarily be said to be the same as homosexuality.


He faulted the minister for directing the police to embark on the arrest of homosexuals, arguing that the police, by their professional training, must be seen to be carrying out their duty, if there is a breach of the law, without being prompted.
Source Daily Guide Ghana

 

[Bannanasketch]

Can I be the first to say that these people are not Christians. They may claim to be "Christians" and may claim to do these things in Jesus' name but that's absolutely not true. I believe that true Christians are people who accept Jesus as their Lord and Savior and live their lives as he did. These people are not living thir lives out like Jesus did. Christ lived to show love,while many "Christians" live out of hate such as this group or the WBC. Jesus loves you, no matter what you may hear. Again, these groups that you post about are not Christians like you think but rather the very opposite.

 

[frogboy4]

I agree.

It is a complicated issue because some otherwise Christian-behaving congregations in the US support these foreign leaders that round-up and oppress gay minorities in other parts of the world. I don't know that all of them actually understand what is being done or authorize all the practices, but this is the result. Even Rick Warren was tied to some of these groups until he found out what was going on. I'm not fan of anything Mr Warren has to say, but he's certainly would not support the deeds this article outlines and he has made comments against such practices. However, there are some charismatic leaders here that do approve of these holy crusades and not all of them come off as nutters. It's important to know that not all bigotry is as blatant like with the WBC people. Most of the damage is done quietly and by-proxy. That's all I'm trying to show with this article. I believe that the majority of the western-Christian folk would not support these deeds.

 

[RedPiggy]

I don't do the "no true Scotsman" fallacy. These people ARE Christians, just jerkwad Christians. Even in the bible, you see followers of Jesus with various attitudes, from laid back to extreme arrogance (so bad that even those who liked you hated you). The Christianity of James is not the Christianity of Peter or Paul. The bible notes that after Jesus, people tended to gravitate toward the apostles who "floated their boat" more.

I don't know that all of them actually understand what is being done or authorize all the practices, but this is the result.

I find that lots of people rarely examine possible outcomes. Now, I admit that I seem scatterbrained sometimes (sometimes? LOL), but it's because I tend to run a lot of mental simulations. For me, it's not good enough to have a Plan B, but also C, D, E, F, and variants of all of the above (God, I'm so lame).

I distrust the "I didn't understand that would happen." I think they tell themselves that to sleep at night. People all over the world CAN'T be that brain dead. If you decry wearing a seat belt or a helmet ... I find it hard to fathom that it's impossible to entertain the possibility injury is on its way. I mean, I can get not wanting to admit we're vulnerable, but ... daaaang. When you have an ideology that promotes exclusion based on characteristics with no verifiable objective harm to be assessed, the logical step is ... well, crap like the Ghana situation.