The Muppet Mindset

Convincing John

Convincing John

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Drtooth said:
And it's the LAST time I'm giving an opinion on ANYTHING, believe you me.
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Well, you do have the right to feel the way you do and a right to your own opinion. Fans don't have to be 100% positive about everything that comes out of Muppet Studios, Henson or Sesame Workshop. We want to be supportive of Jim Henson's characters, no matter who owns 'em. We care about 'em. Frank Oz said once that "Jim just wanted to do good work." That's what we want, too.

I've read other Muppet-related reviews that are way, way, way more "negative" than yours. PM me if you want to discuss more.

I think you mentioned once that you watched Animaniacs during its original run. If you have, you might get this reference:

In your article, you basically revealed Chicken Boo's identity. However, instead of people getting angry at Chicken Boo, (like in the cartoons) you were the one who everyone got angry at. I've done that before myself (not here, plus it was about a different subject entirely), but I got the "Chicken Boo treatment", too. People sometimes don't want to know that it's a chicken in disguise, no matter how obvious it is.

They don't say it in the actual episode, but in the FR book based on "Marooned", there's this little exchange between Red and Boober.

Boober says something to the effect of "I guess it's no fun having someone around like me" (referring to his pessimism).

Red replies with, and I quote: "No Boober, that's just not fair. You have a right to feel the way you do."

Just some thoughts to keep in mind.

Convincing John
 
The Count

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Hey Prawn, check jour mail, sent ju something okay.
 
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Drtooth

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Convincing John said:
Well, you do have the right to feel the way you do and a right to your own opinion. Fans don't have to be 100% positive about everything that comes out of Muppet Studios, Henson or Sesame Workshop. We want to be supportive of Jim Henson's characters, no matter who owns 'em. We care about 'em. Frank Oz said once that "Jim just wanted to do good work." That's what we want, too.

I've read other Muppet-related reviews that are way, way, way more "negative" than yours. PM me if you want to discuss more.

I think you mentioned once that you watched Animaniacs during its original run. If you have, you might get this reference:

In your article, you basically revealed Chicken Boo's identity. However, instead of people getting angry at Chicken Boo, (like in the cartoons) you were the one who everyone got angry at. I've done that before myself (not here, plus it was about a different subject entirely), but I got the "Chicken Boo treatment", too. People sometimes don't want to know that it's a chicken in disguise, no matter how obvious it is.
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I've posted it several times already, and yes, people have a right to say "I think that's a negative opinion"... people don't have a right to say "I don't like your opinion" and start name calling and destroying a good discussion that NEEDS to be made.

I have defended pretty much everything I see nothing but negative reviews and opinions about. I've been pretty lenient on certain things, I've defended everything but the director and Sony for MFS, and I even liked the Muppet comics way way all the way back when everyone was complaining about how Kermit looked.

What I cannot defend is uncertainty and trying to be optimistic when, let's face it, 9 times out of 10 when something like this happens, we wait for ages for news to find out there WAS no news and there never will be... companies buying up DVD rights only to either sit on them or release the "Cartoon Catchphrase" collection of 5-10 episodes out of order... movie studios sitting on rights to movies only to pump out something within days of the expiration date that they barely care about (Smurfs... and I swear Dragonball Evolution came out of Fox not wanting to lose another license for a movie they had no interest in making, like they did with Watchmen)... toy companies whining that the licensee going over their heads for collectors, saying "we can do the same" only to NOT (Playmates' plans for the TMNT 25th anniversary). Sometimes, these things DO get lost.

And it's not just that... there's nothing but complaints, whining, and negativity on EVERY web board I've ever been on, yet if I want to say something, I get a nice little 8 page flame war of name calling, bullying, immaturity (from people calling ME immature)... all by people who just want to start flame wars and NO intelligent conversation. That's why this is the ONLY board I even bother with anymore.

After I see the movie and give it a glowing review, more glowing than most everyone else's, I'm done with webboards entirely. My life is frustrating enough without having to defend myself and my opinion and get a freaking stomach ulcer in the process. it's nice to know ONE person understands, right?
 
Convincing John

Convincing John

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Drtooth said:
And it's not just that... there's nothing but complaints, whining, and negativity on EVERY web board I've ever been on, yet if I want to say something, I get a nice little 8 page flame war of name calling, bullying, immaturity (from people calling ME immature)... all by people who just want to start flame wars and NO intelligent conversation. That's why this is the ONLY board I even bother with anymore.

After I see the movie and give it a glowing review, more glowing than most everyone else's, I'm done with webboards entirely. My life is frustrating enough without having to defend myself and my opinion and get a freaking stomach ulcer in the process. it's nice to know ONE person understands, right?
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Yeah, the lack of news about new projects that are never finished is a letdown for me, too. Would I want to see a Fraggle Rock movie made with the same love and care that is(hopefully) being put in the new Muppet movie? You bet! Then when it doesn't happen...well, yeah, it tends to get on one's nerves.

How many times has the Jim Henson Company said "We're doing a new such and such. It's gonna be great!" then nothing happens and crickets chirp?

I'll admit there have been projects I didn't like, stuff I wished could have been made better and other things I wished could have been made period.

Still, it's important to remember that some good things came out recently. Palisades is just one example. Jim really enjoyed details in things. I think he really would have enjoyed seeing those made were he still alive today.

You'll get people who'll try to flame and bully you from time to time. It's happened to me, too. (Not here, elsewhere). It's just not cool when people have the opportunity to discuss something important, but either don't or go on "rabbit trails" (getting off the topic and just saying random things). You have no one to talk about the original topic and people see you as a stick-in-the-mud for not goofing off like they are.

It happened to me in an Art History class I took. I wanted to discuss more about the artist and his work (which fascinated me). However, there were a lot of my classmates who didn't care and just talked about whatever they wanted, laughed, joked, etc. When I became frustrated, guess who everyone saw as the "party pooper" who was "too stuck up"?

I wound up reading more about the artist in the library later, plus going over the professor's lecture notes. That was all well and good, but when you have a discussion with different ideas about something, it can open up a whole new way to understand and appreciate the topic at hand.

Truthfully...you can only get so much knowledge from the skeletal information supplied by print or online resources. When you can have an engaging conversation about something you care about, it takes the subject to a whole new level.

Convincing John
 
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Drtooth

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Convincing John said:
Yeah, the lack of news about new projects that are never finished is a letdown for me, too. Would I want to see a Fraggle Rock movie made with the same love and care that is(hopefully) being put in the new Muppet movie? You bet! Then when it doesn't happen...well, yeah, it tends to get on one's nerves.

How many times has the Jim Henson Company said "We're doing a new such and such. It's gonna be great!" then nothing happens and crickets chirp?
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Yeah, but in that case, we eventually got plans that it's further and further from being made. And let's go through that one... months of cautious optimism, followed by a little doubt... then news that something's happening so we have more cautious optimism followed by a slow decline in optimism... then a pessimistic report BY the writer of the movie that kept telling us to be optimistic!

That can easily be the case here. Everything we've heard is "No plans at this point" and that usually means "No plans EVAH!"

I'll admit there have been projects I didn't like, stuff I wished could have been made better and other things I wished could have been made period.

Still, it's important to remember that some good things came out recently. Palisades is just one example. Jim really enjoyed details in things. I think he really would have enjoyed seeing those made were he still alive today.
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What really bugs me is I'm nothing BUT positive when it comes to those projects and I can't get a conversation started about how great I think they are, I always get ignored UNLESS I say the 30% of stuff I say that is negative. I'm sure NO ONE reads these comic book reviews I do. Worst thing I ever said is that Muppet Sherlock Holmes needed work, and was kind of weak in the middle 2 issues. Which is WHY exactly the Marvel plans at this point bug me. They WERE great, and I don't think license consolidation and corporate parenting should end that... especially the way they did.
 
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