Disney greenlights "The Muppet Show" comics

[lowercasegods]

I happen to like this artwork and think it is edgier and darker than we've seen the Muppets drawn. I think Jim Henson would approve and love it as he always wanted the Muppets to be adult and edgy.

Right now people are judging it by its cover and we haven't even seen the final product.

PS. Perhaps Bunsen conducted an experiment and Gonzo grew another finger? I'm willing to think outside the box and keep my mind open to this. A lot of folks are already banging nails into the coffin. I see something different and wonderful to the provided covers.

I'm not saying whether or not Jim would approve. How could anyone know that? Though it's been proven by comments such as that from Steve Whitmire that Jim highly disapproved of Muppet products that were ugly and off-model. And speaking of which, drawing off model is NOT the same thing as being dark and edgy. If that were the case, then every four year old who draws a scribbly picture of Kermit in crayon is capable of drawing dark and edgy. But again, that's just me and speaking through my experiences in cartooning. You're entitled to your thoughts.

I need to stress again that I'm not commenting on the covers. That analogy doesn't even pertain. I'm talking about the INTERIOR ART AND WRITING. I've seen it. I've read it. I'm judging it by that, as anyone who reads the completed comic will. That's how you judge a comic, by it's interior, not exterior (though ultimately it's the cover that will grab a reader first--and Langridge hasn't given readers much to be grabbed over).

I give you complete credit for backing this comic and for standing by your opinion, and I truly hope you enjoy the finished product. If it's as wonderful as you hope, then all the better for the Muppets. I'm just putting in my two cents like anyone else here, as a Muppet fan and as a professional cartoonist. I just want the best possible product, and in my opinion, I'm not seeing it with this attempt.

 

[frogboy4]

I have faith that the artwork can evolve to some sort of edgy Muppety state and it's good to see someone experimenting with the designs. Roger Langridge has said as much recently over at Tough Pigs, over on his site and also in an email response to me.

I do appreciate his pseudo-underground, off model, stylistic approach to the characters. I felt not enough research was done with core Muppets before leaping in but I suppose that is his process. He has admitted to making some Muppets Studio requested changes and is still settling in.

Right now we have Langridge's Disney Adventures bits that have floated around, some inside glimpses of his experimental preview comic and some cover artwork. It's not much to go on, but there is enough to critique. However we know changes are being made as he goes along.

Muppet cartoons of the past have ranged from frighteningly awful to stiff to different types of stylization. I adore the Gilchrest renditions; however that style now appears to be dated in the 80s. They did a wonderful complete job with the characters and now it's time for a fresh take. I'm actually hoping for a few different artists' takes in the coming years.

Nonetheless, I am likening Langridge's Muppets to an almost Tex Avery approach to the characters. Not all of the deformations are pleasing to me, but they are definitely more expressive. Some of my personal issues arise from pegging just why a character like Fozzie is motivated into making a particular wagging tongue expression.

 

[uppitymuppity]

This is to Lowercasegods:

I've looked at your previous posts and I see no post that mentions you've read this particular comic from front to back. You've said you've checked out this and that online... Where is your full review of the content, storylines, etc...? I'm confused. How could you have seen unreleased material and not reviewed it in its entirety?

I think you may have a somewhat biased view.

 

[frogboy4]

This is to Lowercasegods:

I've looked at your previous posts and I see no post that mentions you've read this particular comic from front to back. You've said you've checked out this and that online... Where is your full review of the content, storylines, etc...? I'm confused. How could you have seen unreleased material and not reviewed it in its entirety?

I think you may have a somewhat biased view.

I think LCG's being fair so far. He's judging from the preview comic that came out last year. It was intended as a promotional piece but has served as a polarizing lightning rod. It was several pages and used to promote this new four-series comic. Many people have read the entire thing. I've seen most of it and certainly enough to know that the character design needs work. However this work is something Langridge has intended from the start. He has recently stated in the fantastic Tough Pigs interview that he will be improving this (hideous) Gonzo design.

I think it is completely fair to make an assumption of the work by citing the very full-fledged pieces intended to promote the upcoming comic. However LCG has stated that he won't keep him from reading the comic in hopes that improvements have been made.

The story's, on the other hand, appear to be very Muppety.

 

[lowercasegods]

This is to Lowercasegods:

I've looked at your previous posts and I see no post that mentions you've read this particular comic from front to back. You've said you've checked out this and that online... Where is your full review of the content, storylines, etc...? I'm confused. How could you have seen unreleased material and not reviewed it in its entirety?

I think you may have a somewhat biased view.

I didn't say I read it front to back. I said I saw some of the interior artwork. And that was from the preview booklet at The San Diego Comic Con. They've had it posted at Toughpigs for awhile now if you want to check it out (they also have an insigtful interview with Langridge). If I gave you the impression that I read it cover to cover, then I did a lousy job of explaining, and I apologize for that. My judgment is from what interior art I've seen, not the book in its entirety.

And I agree with your statement that I have a somewhat biased view. As a professional cartoonist and Muppet fan, I'm very selective of the quality of work that goes into a book like this. I hold Muppet products up to a higher standard than I would, say, a comic based on a Hanna Barbera creation. The Muppets have so much substance and history to them, and appeal to such a wide and varied demographic that I would hope for only the best talent to be involved in the book. And regretfully, I don't see that in Langridge's work.

Now, if I had my druthers, I'd put cartoonist Dave Alvarez on the book. The few Muppet comics he created and posted here (under the name Muppetwolf I think, though I may be wrong) were just fabulous. In fact, I e-mailed him and encouraged him to submit his work to the comic. Muppet fans deserve to see his level of talent.

But beyond all this, I want to get across that I'm not looking to make an adversary of you. I respect your opinion, and don't mean to ruffle your feathers. I'm just sharing my opinion, and no one's obligated to listen or agree. I suppose we should consider ourselves lucky that we even have a Muppet comic to debate, since (besides those produced by Langridge for Disney Adventures) there hasn't been a regular Muppet comic since Star Comics produced the Muppet Babies book in the mid 80's. But regardless, I consider this debate a friendly one. But I'm willing to leave it alone if you feel slighted by my words.

 

[lowercasegods]

I think LCG's being fair so far. He's judging from the preview comic that came out last year. It was intended as a promotional piece but has served as a polarizing lightning rod. It was several pages and used to promote this new four-series comic. Many people have read the entire thing. I've seen most of it and certainly enough to know that the character design needs work. However this work is something Langridge has intended from the start. He has recently stated in the fantastic Tough Pigs interview that he will be improving this (hideous) Gonzo design.

I think it is completely fair to make an assumption of the work by citing the very full-fledged pieces intended to promote the upcoming comic. However LCG has stated that he won't keep him from reading the comic in hopes that improvements have been made.

The story's, on the other hand, appear to be very Muppety.

Thanks for the validation of my feelings, Frogboy. I appreciate it!

 

[uppitymuppity]

I do not feel slighted or ruffled in the least. It's a healthy conversation as far as i'm concerned and it's nice to see a dedicated fan/artist.

We can safely agree that we are all very lucky to see such a thing in production...! I, for one, will be pestering my comic book store and camping out for that release!

 

[Drtooth]

Muppet cartoons of the past have ranged from frighteningly awful to stiff to different types of stylization. I adore the Gilchrest renditions; however that style now appears to be dated in the 80s. They did a wonderful complete job with the characters and now it's time for a fresh take. I'm actually hoping for a few different artists' takes in the coming years.

I wonder if you're talking about the Muppets take Manhattan Marvel comics adaption. You know, the one with the Purple Rowlf on the cover.

You gotta admit, they aren't going for the "try to look as Japanese as possible" bit that everyone's doing these days (especially fan comics/web comics 12 year olds have littered the internet with)... especially since Japanese comics nowadays actually look more Western than some of the Western comics... Shaman King has a very Marvel comics quality to it... and One Piece seems to borrow it's double takes from Tex Avery, in lieu of the old Super Deformer look... even the Japanese Sesame Street comics shied away from that... (though, the humans do have a slight anime quality to them, if you really look at them).

That said, as long as the level of writing isn't 1960's Gold Key or Whitman comics quality... you know, the licensed comics that had characters like Daffy Duck and the like not coming close to their original versions, and with interchangeable dialogue and plots that seem like they use Mad Libs to write (putting characters in the same plot, changing only names here and there). Carlton Comics must've been the worst. I read a Yogi Bear comic that was reprinted by Harvey (assumingly from Carlton) that was virtually unreadable, and had no trace of actual Yogi Bear dialogue or humor in it, and very clumsy plotlines and writing throughout. I once read a Cartlon Flintstone comic that was a trillion times worse than that. Yikes! I really like what DC has been doing with the Looney Tunes and Cartoon Network characters... ditto Bongo's Simpsons/Futurama line.

 

[lowercasegods]

I wonder if you're talking about the Muppets take Manhattan Marvel comics adaption. You know, the one with the Purple Rowlf on the cover.

You gotta admit, they aren't going for the "try to look as Japanese as possible" bit that everyone's doing these days (especially fan comics/web comics 12 year olds have littered the internet with)... especially since Japanese comics nowadays actually look more Western than some of the Western comics... Shaman King has a very Marvel comics quality to it... and One Piece seems to borrow it's double takes from Tex Avery, in lieu of the old Super Deformer look... even the Japanese Sesame Street comics shied away from that... (though, the humans do have a slight anime quality to them, if you really look at them).

That said, as long as the level of writing isn't 1960's Gold Key or Whitman comics quality... you know, the licensed comics that had characters like Daffy Duck and the like not coming close to their original versions, and with interchangeable dialogue and plots that seem like they use Mad Libs to write (putting characters in the same plot, changing only names here and there). Carlton Comics must've been the worst. I read a Yogi Bear comic that was reprinted by Harvey (assumingly from Carlton) that was virtually unreadable, and had no trace of actual Yogi Bear dialogue or humor in it, and very clumsy plotlines and writing throughout. I once read a Cartlon Flintstone comic that was a trillion times worse than that. Yikes! I really like what DC has been doing with the Looney Tunes and Cartoon Network characters... ditto Bongo's Simpsons/Futurama line.

Oh man, that purple Rowlf---I actually bought that Marvel Super Special back in 1984 when it first came out. If you get the chance to read it, you'll see TONS of off model inconsistencies. I swear, it's like Marvel was saying, "Whose the worst artist we can find to draw this comic? That guy? Okay. Now let's hire his dog."

 

[JJandJanice]

Well I've already asked my favorite comic book shop, Ed's Cards and Comics (little bit of a cheap plug for anyone whom lives in the colorado area) to hold a copy for me. He knows me pretty well, I'm a regular of his, lol, in fact I'm sure it was a sad day for him when I quit my job cause he knows that means he's losing money as well, .

But yeah I do agree with everyone about the artwork of this comic, it's not that great I don't care for it all too much. But I'll give it a shot anyway.