The Jim Henson Hour Appreciation Thread

[minor muppetz]

I wonder why the "First Show" wasn't broadcast as the first. It's a much stronger episode than "Outer Space" (could that have been broadcast first because science fiction was big then? has there been a time since the 1970s when science fiction WASN'T big?). For awhile had wondered if they wanted the first episode to have a StoryTeller for the second half-hour, but then I recently read that The Heartless Giant WAS originally going to be paired with the Bobby McFerrin first half-hour.

Whether it was paired with The Heartless Giant or Miss Piggy's Hollywood it's still one of the strongest shows. The first two episodes focus primarily on Kermit and Digit (and to a lesser extent Lindbergh and Waldo) with the other characters making smaller appearances, but "First Show" featurs plenty of Kermit, Digit, Bean Bunny, Lindbergh, Waldo, and Vicki (can't remember off-hand if Gonzo, Leon, and Link are featured enough like that). Unless maybe they didn't want the audience to have to be too familiar with too many characters for the first two episodes.

 

[minor muppetz]

Something has just occurred to me regarding the fact that the pilot was broadcast later yet was a much stronger episode than the first two broadcast ones. I had been wondering why they had that one broadcast later, but then I was reading in Jim Henson: The Biography that Henson did some additional editing before it was broadcast.... Could it be that it was the editing and (most likely) filming additional segments that made it a much better episode?

The Red Book website confirmed that The Heartless Giant was originally going to be the second half-hour, and then got replaced with Miss Piggy's Hollywood and as a result Jim's introductions got reshot. And the scene with Kermit calling Miss Piggy was likely shot later (though I wonder if maybe "Miss Piggy's Hollywood" was meant as a ficticious project that then became an actual production within the show... there's a few things about that scene that make me wonder if that's the case).

But then maybe the difference between how it originally was and how it aired was as different as how different the first two episodes of The Muppet Show were between the original pilot versions and the aired versions.

 

[minor muppetz]

Muppet Wiki now lists the production order for the show (based on personal correspondence with The Jim Henson Company):

• Videotape/The True Bride
• Food/The Three Ravens
• Garbage/Sapsorrow
• Dog City
• First Show/Miss Piggy's Hollywood
• Outer Space/The Heartless Giant
• Fitness/Song of the Cloud Forest
• Power/The Soldier and Death
• Oceans/Lighthouse Island
• Monster Maker
• Living with Dinosaurs
• The Secrets of the Muppets

It's interesting that most of the first few episodes ended up being among the last broadcast (not counting the hour-long specials). As I've said before, I feel like the first two broadcast episodes were weak starter episodes, so I am surprised to see they were made so late in the show's run.

I know that the recording and production order for The Muppet Show was different, and that's probably the case here. But I am still surprised to see the pilot still listed as the fifth episode. I've been told that the production order doesn't change even if the recording order does, so I wonder if that was meant to be made later but then ended up being the first shot.

Though it seems production order might have been complicated, considering all the StoryTeller episodes had been made earlier (I always thought all nine episodes were completed in 1987, but Jim Henson: The Biography seems to imply that some were made after 1987), and Lighthouse Island was shot in 1987. It seems the production order goes by the MuppeTelevision order, as the one-hour specials (without a MuppeTelevision portion) were the last ones produced.

I used to think that they decided to change Solid Foam when Food was made, but after seeing early promotional images from Muppet Magazine that depict Zoot and Animal as members, I figured that would have been the first episode (there's other reasons I had to suspect it was made first, which I think I noted elsewhere) and that they changed Solid Foam. And after learning which one was really the pilot, I figured Food might have been the second episode (after all, Solid Foam wasn't featured as a band in the pilot), and I saw that I was right about it being the second produced... Only to find the Buster Poindexter one (the one with the band featured most prominently) listed first in production order.

I had noticed that Lindbergh was featured more prominently in the first few episodes and then seemed to be phased out, but judging by this production order, it seems he became more major in the last few episodes (though he's barely in The Secrets of the Muppets). And it seemed like Solid Foam became more prominent in the last few episodes, and Beard became a more major character (Digit and Clifford were both individually major throughout the show), so I was surprised to see that the first three episodes in this order are the ones where Solid Foam is featured the most heavily (while Beard would be a fairly major character again by The Secrets of the Muppets, but maybe that's because he was Jerry Nelson's only main character on the show).

Now I wish taping dates would show up somewhere, whether officially or "leaked".

And for fun I thought I'd list the episodes that are equal in production and broadcast number order: Dog City, First Show, Fitness, and arguably Living with Dinosaurs and Secrets of the Muppets.

 

[Oscarfan]

I can't see how "Food" was the second one made with the band they featured in it.

 

[Oscarfan]

Hate to double post, but...

Ever since we've started doing more work at my school's TV station, I've gained a lot appreciation for the MuppeTelevision bits of the show (as well as MT). I agree with Drtooth: the format was great and allowed for a lot more kinds of material they could do. I'd be interested where they could go with the show, character-wise (I can't see them doing something like Gonzo's "My Way" on the show, but they did some very emotional and provocative stuff, like the Ted Danson bit about pollution). The new characters were well-made and performed too; Ubu is a gorgeous puppet and performed so well.

If there's anything I'd have changed, it'd be to give the guest stars a bit more to do and I don't particularly care for the Bootsie and Brad bits (yeah, I get it. They're Barbie spoofs. Bring on more Muppets.) Maybe another song or two per episode would've been fine too.

 

[minor muppetz]

If there's anything I'd have changed, it'd be to give the guest stars a bit more to do and I don't particularly care for the Bootsie and Brad bits (yeah, I get it. They're Barbie spoofs. Bring on more Muppets.) Maybe another song or two per episode would've been fine too.

Yeah I find it odd that the most frequent recurring sketch is one that barely has any Muppets (could it have been featured more because it had live actors who otherwise wouldn't be working on the show?).

I often wonder why each episode of MuppeTelevision and the various specials only had a handful of songs per episode. It seems like it was normally two songs/music numbers per half-hour, not counting instances where part of a song is sung (like Digit singing part of "The Locomotion" or a medley of food song parodies). The Garbage episode is one of the few to have three full songs in a single half-hour. I wonder if it was harder to work out music rights for a network show than it was for The Muppet Show.

And with the shows focus on technology, I feel the most boring segments are the simpler segments that could have easily been done on The Muppet Show. Stuff like "War and Peace, Part 1: War", or "On the Road Again" (that seems like it's as complicated as "In the Navy", though I think I would have liked it better if it weren't a closing number). Of course there are some fairly simple segments I really like, such as Smokey Robinson's numbers, the Merlin sketches, the Gorilla Television scenes, and Sweet Vacation.

 

[minor muppetz]

Looking at the production order list, I feel it does make a little bit of sense that Fitness was produced before Oceans, due to the Merlin sketches in them.

In Fitness, the patient is "a guy with a sword stuck in his head", in Oceans, it's "a guy with a fish stuck through his head". I feel like it makes sense for the "sword" one to come first, with the "fish" one feeling more like a follow-up. Of course, if they did more Merlin sketches, I wonder if they would have kept doing the "guy with a x through his head" gag (which might have worn out its welcome eventually) or if they would have given the patients different problems.

I previously said that I don't care much for a lot of the sketches that could have easily been done on The Muppet Show, but thinking about it more, I also don't care too much for the segments that feature humans who aren't the guest star. There are some great ones, like the Hat Sharpener story, the Screaming No-Nos, the Gorilla Television bits, and the ghost story with Fozzie, but many others aren't too great. Like that weird sketch in Fitness with the couple in the barn, which doesn't really have anything to do with health and fitness. I wonder if it was Jim Henson's decision or NBCs (or somebody elses) to include segments with humans who aren't guest stars.

 

[Oscarfan]

Looking at the production order list, I feel it does make a little bit of sense that Fitness was produced before Oceans, due to the Merlin sketches in them.

In Fitness, the patient is "a guy with a sword stuck in his head", in Oceans, it's "a guy with a fish stuck through his head". I feel like it makes sense for the "sword" one to come first, with the "fish" one feeling more like a follow-up. Of course, if they did more Merlin sketches, I wonder if they would have kept doing the "guy with a x through his head" gag (which might have worn out its welcome eventually) or if they would have given the patients different problems.

I'd say the "fish" one was done first, since it has an announced introduction.

 

[minor muppetz]

One thing I've noticed about the show is that, while The Muppet Show and Muppets Tonight allowed many of their guest stars to show off talents that they weren't known for, it seems all of the guest stars on The Jim Henson Hour did what they were known for and nothing else. None of the non-singers got to sing on the show (though it seems most episodes only had two full musical numbers per half-hour), for example. Most of the guest stars were singers, and I guess they did get to act a little (mainly in their interactions with other characters, most of which weren't exactly sketches, more like honorary talk spots), though I don't know whether many of them were known for acting as much as singing (Buster Poindexter seems like the kind of music performer who could have been an actor/comedian as well as a singer).

And it seems most of the guest stars were mainly popular for a few years in the 1980s and 1990s. Obviously Ted Danson and Smokey Robinson had been stars for a long time and continued to be stars after, and the Today show people were kinda bigger (though their fame seems to be limited to Today). By comparison, many guest stars on TMS and MT had been stars for many years and continue to be famous today.

In Jim Henson: The Biography, it says that Jim Henson wanted each show to be themed around some kind of educational topic, though I never really got the sense of that. I can see Fitness and Oceans having an educational feel, maybe also Garbage, but for the most part MuppeTelevision didn't really feel like an educational show.

Jim Henson: The Biography says that critics were most harsh to the MuppeTelevision segments. Considering some of the stuff mentioned in the book, I have a feeling that MuppeTelevision would have also failed if it was all original characters, and maybe even if it was mostly familiar characters. The format seems like it would have worked on MTV, Nickelodeon, or Adult Swim, though. I can't believe that the biography mentions that critics also disliked Jim Henson's introductions, calling his performance "stiff". I feel Jim did a good job in his intros. His performance seemed natural to me.

I keep saying that the first two episodes were poor choices for being the first two episodes because they seem to only focus on Kermit, Digit, and to a lesser extent Lindbergh (and to an even lesser extent, Waldo in the first episode), while other episodes seem to have a good balance of other characters throughout the show. Not just because they are two of the episodes with the biggest lack of classic characters, but in both episodes the other characters seem to just show up for one scene (and in the first they all get back together for the closing number, including some characters who weren't in the episode earlier). But something hit me about this regarding the first episode: with the exception of Bean Bunny having a featured role in the Space Guy sketch, none of the sketches star or feature any of the shows intended main characters (unless the Extremes were intended to be major but weren't). All the other skits have really minor characters who were barely seen again, before or after. And with the exception of Neutron Dance, all of the sketches feature human actors as well. Oceans did a little better in this regard, casting Gonzo and Leon in the pirate sketch, and having Clifford narrate the closing sketch (and also having Rowlf star in one sketch), but even with more use of the shows main characters I feel that was one of the weakest episodes of MuppeTelevision.

 

[minor muppetz]

I wonder if Henson ever made any official pictures of the Solid Foam band, besides early photos that featured Animal and Zoot as part of the band. It seems like something they should have done.

I also wonder if the company made any non-still pictures from any segments. It seems like almost every Muppet Show segment got pictures taken (okay, so I haven't seen non-still pictures from every TMS sketch), it'd be great if they did that for MuppeTelevision (I also wonder if they did that for Muppets Tonight). Though I wonder if it would have been hard to make pictures from segments that required a lot of visual effects. Pretty much every promotional photo shows the Muppets in a real studio (or a physical set), as opposed to promotional images with computer animated TV backgrounds and post-production monitor images.

So First Show had a number of things changed before it was broadcast. I'm pretty sure the Miss Piggy bit would have been done later, after it was decided to make Miss Piggy's Hollywood the second half hour. I wonder if the ratings plotline was added later... The episode seems to have two main plots (Digit malfunctioning and the ratings) which are unrelated. Though one thing this episode does that others don't is have characters appear way in the background, behind monitors (I thought it was just main characters on special monitors), and I think I've seen that done in scenes that have to do with both plots (if it's something they decided to drop after the pilot, then why tape more of that after changing the episode?). I wonder if the characters really were there, way in the background (perhaps with plain blue sets for them to be behind), or if they were shot seperately like the many monitor images.

And whenever Digit and Gonzo appear together, I wonder if they really are together, or if they are taped separately and one matted (well, I think Gonzo was recorded separately in Videotape, due to the fastforwarding effect).