When did fans get tired of Pepe?

[minor muppetz]

Lately it seems a lot of fans have expressed a hatred, annoyance, or disliking of Pepe. But I wonder, when did the hate begin?

When Muppets from Space came out and Pepe was first integrated among the main classic Muppet characters it seems everybody liked him. Everybody who reviewed MFS liked Pepe (even if they disliked the movie), and fans were heavily desiring Pepe merchandise (and while we have gotten some merchandise, the amount of Pepe merchandise seems to remain small).

I don't recall anybody hating Pepe until around the time I joined the forum (in fact it seems the same way regarding Speedy Gonzales when I joined the Golden Age Cartoons forum). Some seem to have been worried he'd become the "Elmo" of the Muppets franchise (I think some were worried even at the time of MFS) but while he's been pushed to the top 7 it seems he's not quite as popular as Elmo, marketing-wise. In the past few years it seems Animal is the character put on most merchandise (I'm surprised Animal didn't have his own solo viral video, and I guess I'm surprised about the lack of Pepe viral videos).

 

[Slackbot]

Speaking only for myself, I got sick of him when watching MWoO. He was always making smartcracks, many of which popped me out of the story. ("I'm naked, okay!") It was like they were shoving his face into the camera 'cause it's wiseASCIIness that them Nielsens wanna see, yup, sure!

He's fine in small doses, when he's just one of the crew, but I don't want him eclipsing the other Muppets with his shticks.

 

[Psammeadboi]

I tend to think that Pepe ushered in the new era of Muppet humor - which was beyond the vaudeville, innocent, naive humor the Muppets are known for.

I agre, he's good in small doses, but not as a tool to overshadow the original Muppet characters just because their original performers are gone.

 

[Drtooth]

Jeez. Speak for yourself. Pepe isn't just one of my favorite new characters, he's one of my favorite characters period.

Let's not forget, we didn't have Rowlf, the entire Electric Mayhem, Scooter, and everyone else that used to have significant standing in the group recast or even written into bigger roles until recently. New characters ALWAYS come out of the need to fill voids that other characters that cannot be used have left. Look at Muppets Tonight... Frank Oz was frequently unavailable on top of that, so they had hit or miss new additions to the cast. Same thing happened with Sesame Street... they added all these new characters to fill voids left by the same puppeteers. But in both cases, only a handful of characters survived and are still relevant.

I think we were pretty lucky coming out of MT... we got only the best characters in future roles. Johnny, Sal, Pepe, VanNeuter.... and even then, Brian's not with the Muppets anymore, so Pepe and Big Mean Carl seem to be the only ones really left. But that means we left behind stinker characters like Spamella Hamderson, Bill the Bubble Guy, Mr. Poodlepants... and other than that one appearance of Andy and Randy Pig in Cooking with Cat Cora, we haven't seen them (comic books don't count).

 

[Mo Frackle]

I think we were pretty lucky coming out of MT... we got only the best characters in future roles. Johnny, Sal, Pepe, VanNeuter.... and even then, Brian's not with the Muppets anymore, so Pepe and Big Mean Carl seem to be the only ones really left.

And Bobo. Can't forget Bobo.

 

[Drtooth]

Yeah... Bobo too. Seems like Bill needed a character or two, and Pepe (and Bobo) came out of that need to perform some characters. Now it seems the ban on Dr. Teeth and Rowlf is over, so maybe we'll see more of them than his own characters... I can't really tell.

I could almost parallel this to David Rudman and how Baby Bear became a major character on Sesame Street... but it almost seems like you see less of him now that David's also Cookie Monster.

 

[minor muppetz]

Let's not forget, we didn't have Rowlf, the entire Electric Mayhem, Scooter, and everyone else that used to have significant standing in the group recast or even written into bigger roles until recently. New characters ALWAYS come out of the need to fill voids that other characters that cannot be used have left. Look at Muppets Tonight... Frank Oz was frequently unavailable on top of that, so they had hit or miss new additions to the cast. Same thing happened with Sesame Street... they added all these new characters to fill voids left by the same puppeteers. But in both cases, only a handful of characters survived and are still relevant.

I think we were pretty lucky coming out of MT... we got only the best characters in future roles. Johnny, Sal, Pepe, VanNeuter.... and even then, Brian's not with the Muppets anymore, so Pepe and Big Mean Carl seem to be the only ones really left. But that means we left behind stinker characters like Spamella Hamderson, Bill the Bubble Guy, Mr. Poodlepants... and other than that one appearance of Andy and Randy Pig in Cooking with Cat Cora, we haven't seen them (comic books don't count).

It seems like they were slowly starting to recast many characters after Muppets Tonight ended, at the same time Pepe was satrting to become one of the main characters. And while we pretty much only got the best Muppets Tonight characters to return, Seymour didn't return (I also really like Bill, who hasn't been used since). Some of those "stinker" characters have been used since, though not in any really major roles (Mr. Poodlepants made a cameo in It's a Very Merry Muppet Christmas Movie, Spamela made a cameo on From the Balcony).

 

[Dominicboo1]

I don't hate Pepe, but he's just not one of my favorites. He is pretty funny, but I thought Rowlf as Toto should have been obvious. I'm just a Rowlf fan though. I named a dog after him.

 

[Duke Remington]

It seems like they were slowly starting to recast many characters after Muppets Tonight ended, at the same time Pepe was satrting to become one of the main characters. And while we pretty much only got the best Muppets Tonight characters to return, Seymour didn't return (I also really like Bill, who hasn't been used since). Some of those "stinker" characters have been used since, though not in any really major roles (Mr. Poodlepants made a cameo in It's a Very Merry Muppet Christmas Movie, Spamela made a cameo on From the Balcony).

In addition, Howard Tubman also appeared in IaVMMCM as the Muppet Theater's choreographer.

 

[frogboy4]

I love Pepe and always have since his debut. I've never gotten tired of Pepe even though he was over-exposed for a while. It seemed that mainly Bill and Steve were on-call for Muppeting so Pepe and Kermit became the most visible characters. Let's not fault the prawn or frog for rising to the occasion when needed.

Most fans who don't like the prawn are likely purists who don't want any new/post-Jim character to rise to the level of first tear, but I think he's helped keep the Muppets fresh for a generation. He's been around for 15 years now. He's not a "new" Muppet anymore.

I know when some fans got tired of him = "Muppets Wizard of Oz". That's when he allegedly usurped Rowlf's role as Toto. Barretta performs both characters and Pepe was chosen as the more popular star to handle that part. I can see both sides of the argument. Pepe appeals to younger people and his humor is more biting. I won't call it cynical, sleazy or unmuppety. In fact, after seeing Stuffed & Unstrung I'm convinced that Pepe's the bridge that brings a lot of the ever present off-screen Muppeteer antics into an onscreen character. That's his strength and some fans won't accept that sort of Muppet just as some don't like his or Clifford's obvious ethnicity. That has always bugged me because the Swedish Chef has an accent, but i suppose Caucasians are given a pass by some folk.

Anyway, those are my theories. Segel has done a wonderful job with all he's included in this new Muppets movie. However, I am a little disappointed in him reportedly not giving Pepe much more than a line or two. Maybe it wasn't personal seeing as Rizzo evidently suffers laryngitis throughout the new film. I'm just glad to have Scooter and Rowlf back. I'm sure Pepe will be around a lot more in the future. People do love the prawn. He no longer has to be the face of the Muppets anymore. He can perform at his leisure. That's what I support. Seeing him just as much as Fozzie, Gonzo, Rowlf and Scooter.