Why Is Sesame Street Such A Controversial Lightning Rod?

[beaker]

You know, the more Roosevelt Franklin Elementary School skits I watch, the more painfully obvious it was that they had to stop them. And the more I realize it has nothing to do with race.

The kids wisecrack, they throw papers and pencils... that bit at the end where Hard Head says that Tina has elephant feet? Imitable acts. That kinda encourages kids to be rude to the teachers and each other. Then you look at other school segments they have had since, and the kids are always well behaved. If you can't have a song writer bang his head on the piano, you sure can't have a bunch of school children throwing stuff around.

Haha, I love it. I want a whole dvd of just Rosevelt Franklin related skits

 

[CensoredAlso]

The kids wisecrack, they throw papers and pencils... that bit at the end where Hard Head says that Tina has elephant feet? Imitable acts. That kinda encourages kids to be rude to the teachers and each other. Then you look at other school segments they have had since, and the kids are always well behaved. If you can't have a song writer bang his head on the piano, you sure can't have a bunch of school children throwing stuff around.

I see that as art imitating life. That is often how kids behave in class. And they would do it with or without the TV. There's no point in painting a false picture of the real world. The point of the segments was to show that despite their rough edges, the kids were learning something.

 

[Drtooth]

That's because today's society and youth are so brain addled with an ADHD world woven around them. I see a lot of children aping the twitchy text and smart phone compulsions they see high schoolers and adults engage in 24/7. Post millennial kids shows and entertainment in general is mostly just bloated, empty calorie garbage that is so far removed from the organic artistry and warmth of kids shows and entertainment from just 15 years ago and older.

I find that a gross oversimplification. There will always be crap, crap always existed, and the nostalgia filter is always wrong. The Dora mode preschool program is (thankfully) dying out, Sesame Street is getting more complex with its message, and the newer preschool shows are starting to become good again. And I can't say enough for the new crop of older kid's programming.

I see that as art imitating life. That is often how kids behave in class. And they would do it with or without the TV. There's no point in painting a false picture of the real world. The point of the segments was to show that despite their rough edges, the kids were learning something.

Kids are like that, true. Older, out of control kids that get reprimanded do that. Unfortunately, it does send the message to kids that it's okay to do that in class. NONE of the characters ever get reprimanded for throwing things, insulting the other students, or the rude behavior. That may be fine for an older kid's show, like say Fat Albert (they often do get reprimanded for screwing around... at least Rudy does). But we're talking about an educational show for little kids. While I have no problem with it myself, in fact I think it's really really funny (and I want a compilation too), I can just imagine the letters from angry teachers. Basically the other students that aren't Roosevelt are kinda setting a bad example for the younger children. These are kindergarten and first grade age kids watching (at the time). They don't know that it's supposed to be a joke.

 

[CensoredAlso]

Kids are like that, true. Older, out of control kids that get reprimanded do that. Unfortunately, it does send the message to kids that it's okay to do that in class. NONE of the characters ever get reprimanded for throwing things, insulting the other students, or the rude behavior. That may be fine for an older kid's show, like say Fat Albert (they often do get reprimanded for screwing around... at least Rudy does). But we're talking about an educational show for little kids. While I have no problem with it myself, in fact I think it's really really funny (and I want a compilation too), I can just imagine the letters from angry teachers. Basically the other students that aren't Roosevelt are kinda setting a bad example for the younger children. These are kindergarten and first grade age kids watching (at the time). They don't know that it's supposed to be a joke.

We'll have to file this under "agree to disagree." Lol. I think those segments were inspirational because it showed realistic kids actually learning something.

Not like the bland Barney groupies that resembled no kid that ever existed, lol.

And kids do NOT need the TV to teach them to be cruel, lol.

 

[Drtooth]

It's kind of hard to believe a show that pulled an entire character for bashing his head on a piano wouldn't take a second look at misbehaving older kids in a school room. Realistic or not realistic, you have to admit, it does encourage rudeness. If Sesame Street didn't some to the conclusion that a rowdy classroom is a bad example for younger kids, I'm sure they got a lot of letters from angry educators saying that it does. After all, the one thing that is unrealistic with kids that act up that bad in class is that they tend to have detention and recesses taken away.

But darned if it isn't funny.

Plus, I get the impression that Matt Robinson was leaving the show at that time. So maybe that was a factor in Roosevelt leaving. And you know, they never had the character interact with any of the other famous Muppets.

 

[CensoredAlso]

It's kind of hard to believe a show that pulled an entire character for bashing his head on a piano wouldn't take a second look at misbehaving older kids in a school room.

Actually I've been meaning to say this, I don't get the impression Don Music was ever actually banned from the show. Just his head banging. I know that book said that but I think the author was mistaken. I remember seeing a clip on YT of Don from late '80s/early 90s.

Realistic or not realistic, you have to admit, it does encourage rudeness.

Only if you're a rude kid to begin with.

 

[Drtooth]

Actually I've been meaning to say this, I don't get the impression Don Music was ever actually banned from the show. Just his head banging. I know that book said that but I think the author was mistaken. I remember seeing a clip on YT of Don from late '80s/early 90s.

Once you tone down the problem, there's no problem. In later Don bits, they did get rid of the head banging. Part of it was character one-noteness. On that subject, I noticed this skit was rare. I only remember seeing it once when I was a kid... the famous Me Claudius. Watching it again, I noticed something that could have been a reason why it was rare. And I don't think it was so much the pipe

The monsters... kinda hit each other. To give you context, this was a Sesame Street skit in an age where they wouldn't let Superman punch a super villain or even raise a hand against his villains. You couldn't show physical violence in a show for older kids, and they actually got away with monsters slapping and hitting each other. That's amazing. I'm sure not every kid is going to go around smacking each other because of that skit.

I agree that it isn't a TV show's responsibility to teach kids behavior... except when they totally do...

Behavior, consideration, and hygiene.

Only if you're a rude kid to begin with.

Kids find rudeness funny at a very young age. That's the reason fart jokes are in so many kids movies (that and it's a way to give them an artificial PG rating, but that's another rant for another day).

 

[CensoredAlso]

Kids find rudeness funny at a very young age. That's the reason fart jokes are in so many kids movies (that and it's a way to give them an artificial PG rating, but that's another rant for another day).

Well that is true, lol.

 

[beaker]

Dr Tooth, I'm a little confused...you said parent groups have knee jerk reactions to Sesame Street, but that you find Rosevelt Franklin and Guy Smiley inappropriate due to their behavior?

And yeah it was a gross over simplification. However I will say I have great hope for the next generation, even if they are even further removed from a more organic, analog world. I fear one day everything will be one giant Matrix-esque cloud computing wetwire network, with no connection to the old ways of enjoying life. But then I also see how high schoolers now in America are in a very post racial, post homophobic mindset. Extremely open minded, shedding a lot of their parents and societies old prejudices. A lot of inner city schools are starting to turn around as well. I do have hope. And some of my complains may just be my Statler and Waldorf side.

While everyone laughed about the Romney Big Bird thing, Sesame Workshop I realize is facing their two biggest crisis in decades: the loss of Kevin Clash and the fallout of whatever it is he may have done and the impact on their flagship brand and the recent firing of 10% of its work force. While Im glad EMTV sold the rights back to JHC and thus made Sesame its own separate thing completely...sometimes I *do* worry about the future of Sesame Street.

 

[D'Snowth]

I think what Drtooth meant was that Roosevelt Franklin and Don Music displayed some behavior and characteristics that impressionable little kids shouldn't pick up on; cases in point - Roosevelt being the head of a classroom full of rowdy kids, and Don always banging his head on his piano whenever he's frustrated.