Why are Elmo, Zoe, Rosita and Baby Bear so annoying to classic SS fans?

[CookieFan]

Like some folks mentioned before, the classic characters work on two levels, one for kids, one for adults. The newer characters seem geared strictly for kids....and really little ones, too!

No doubt part of that was a conscious decision since the target audience keeps getting younger (my kid's only 18 mos), but I believe that it's freaking HARD to write on two levels and perhaps the current writers don't have the inclination to do so.

 

[Janice & Mokey's Man]

Elmo makes me sick---literally. When I watched the SS biography on A&E, I got such a headache during the whole Elmo/Kevin segment, and I was anxiously strugglin' around, like, "Ugghhh, pleeeeeease move on to somethin' else!!"

Ugh.

He's okay in an EX*TREME*LY small dose (like in MFC, where he didn't speak ), but otherwise, the Elmo fans can have him.

No offense to those who love him, and I'm glad some can rully appreciate him, but I'm just not big on him.

 

[Hays]

It's not just nostalgia!

Yes, I grew up in the 70s with the original muppeteers.

I don't, however, hate the new muppeteers; I rather like Zoe and Rosita; Baby Bear, on the whole, bothers me only slightly. Yes, I don't like Elmo at all - even though my son does (though he seems to be growing out of it)

As a former puppeteer, I have an idea of what current SS is up against, though - and a lot of what you adults are talking about is a sign of the times we live in. Most of that adult-oriented humor was very physical (Grover falling down, people having food fights) or spoofs of adult shows. Unfortunately, parents are extremely sensitive about what their kids watch nowadays, and I'm sure a lot of the "adult" humor has been removed because the producers don't like to be faced with phalanxes of complaining parents. Remember, Henson pretty much had carte blanche because the concept of the show was so new in the 70s.

I remember doing a Hansel and Gretel show that had treating your siblings with kindness as its main moral lesson; achieved by Hansel calling Gretel "stupid," and then acknowledging her heroism and apologising at the end. We got complaints and letters for months about the use of that word (not even an expletive!) I can imagine that SS faces this kind of pressure exponentially, and that the parents don't bother going to them - they probably go to the funders directly. It's got to be difficult to manage dissatisfied parents when they can hit you in the pocketbook.

Now that I'm a parent, I can say with certainty that if you TALK to your kid, you CAN expect your children to learn APPROPRIATE behavior from bad examples, and not the other way around!

Also, having done re-mounts, I can testify to how awful it is to have to live up to other people's standards without giving your characters time to live and grow on their own. It takes time to round out a character; it's hard to develop one on the fly.

I also do think, though, that with the huge losses that SS has faced over the years, they haven't really come up with strong leadership. Kevin Clash is certainly very talented, but I think he's working against type - his other characters, like Benny and Hoots, seem more well-rounded to me. Elmo's World is certainly educational, but it isn't the shared experience that SS used to be.

 

[CookieFan]

Interesting point about producers not wanting to face the wrath of angry parents!

And it's probably too hard to write on two levels (kids & adults) without offending SOMEBODY.

 

[muppettheatre]

For myself personally, it is not the characters themselves that I do not care for, it is the new format. Elmo should never have been given his own segment (Elmo's World), I must admit that Kevin Clash is a brilliant performer, however it seems that all Elmo's Worlds are primarily the same with the exception of the topic. Everyone knows that he's going to watch the whatever channel on tv and that he's going to talk to his goldfish Dorothy, and at some point he's going to ask a baby something. And then at the end he's going to sing the whatever song, which is just to the tune of "jingle bells". Journey to Ernie is another segment that I don't really care for. It's nice in that it gives some much needed attention to the classic characters, namely Big Bird and Ernie, however the computer graphics just get annoying. It's generally the same idea each time, Big Bird looks one or two places and then finds Ernie on the second or third try. The places that Big Bird looks are always the same! One nice thing about Journey to Ernie is that it is where they can throw in some classic sketches that just don't fit in with today's format. I was watching it one day and saw a Bert and Ernie sketch that took me back to my childhood. I feel that today's format is much to organized and predictable. What happened to when there was the story and the segments were more like commercial breaks?

 

[muppettheatre]

Re: It's not just nostalgia!

Originally posted by Hays
Yes, I grew up in the 70s with the original muppeteers.

I don't, however, hate the new muppeteers; I rather like Zoe and Rosita;

Zoe is a great character, but I always prefered Fran Brill's other character, Prairie Dawn, who seems to get very little air time now.

 

[Drtooth]

Actually, there is little adult appeal (it IS there, you just have to look) in some of the current episodes (I had to watch them all. The show's on before I leave on some morning, and there's nothing else on except Jerry Springer...ik). In one episode (Telly and Baby Bear break Zoe's car), Telly stalls Zoe by playing the tuba. Telly replies, "I bet you never heard Inna Gadda Da Vida played on a tuba before!"

A real treat was the season closer, in which Oscar and Telly take a road trip.

Telly goes to get Oscar's Lemon's Sardines and Fudge Sauce at Hooper's store, and Alan seems most concerned and leans over to Telly and says, "You're not on that new "Grouch Diet" are you?

Classic!

 

[SillyRed]

1. Elmo is funny
2. Prairie is seen a lot on Noggin's "Play With Me Sesame"

 

[CookieFan]

Originally posted by muppettheatre
For myself personally, it is not the characters themselves that I do not care for, it is the new format.

.....

I feel that today's format is much to organized and predictable. What happened to when there was the story and the segments were more like commercial breaks?

I have to admit, when I heard that they were changing the format, I was disappointed. Then I watched the way my 18 mo old daughter watches the new SS versus the Classic SS.

Since the viewing audience of SS has gotten younger (my guess is that there's too much other programming for the pre-school to K-3 audience) they producers had to respond to that change.

When I was a kid, we only had 4 TV stations up until I was in 5th grade! Now we have 4 different PBS stations, Nick, Noggin, etc. So many more programs competing for those little eyes.

Toddlers love predictability, so that's why JTE and EW (and well, the whole show) are so structured. My kid knows that she will get to scream BOX! DUCK! every time JTE is on.

Also, toddlers can't follow a broken up story, so they kept it all together in the new eps. Although, my kid can't STAND the On The Street segment and usually gets up and leaves. (she's riveted to the screen for Number & Letter of the Day, JTE, and EW, tho. Pretty impressive keeping a toddler's attention for that long!)

She doesn't "get" the Classic episodes, though. She watches them, but doesn't have that expression of delight that she does when she watches the new eps, even though a lot of the characters are the same.

Just my rambling....

 

[Hays]

.

I have to admit, when I heard that they were changing the format, I was disappointed. Then I watched the way my 18 mo old daughter watches the new SS versus the Classic SS.

I'd agree with that, though, since my boy is 2 1/2 (or three, as he likes to say) I should mention that this phase in development is pretty short-lived; he really doesn't like the repetition so much anymore and hasn't for several months. (though the American Society of Pediatrics or whatever says your kid shouldn't be watching ANY television until the age of two. This is apparently directed towards parents who have perfected the art of teleportation - Scott's been an SS fan since he could see across a room)

He always loved the Cookie Monster segments, though, and is rapidly becoming as big a Cookie Monster fan as I am (and I guess others on this forum!) But his early fixation with Elmo has mostly passed; he gets up and leaves now when Elmo's World comes on unless it's one he hasn't seen 500 times.

1. Elmo is funny

Really? I could argue that he's cute, polite, and a good example, but I don't see that he's funny, unless you're taking that all as sarcasm. Not meaning to be argumentative, I'm just curious what your take on him being funny is