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What's in store for the Muppets in 2012 article

Discussion in 'Muppet Headlines' started by frog75, Dec 8, 2011.

  1. beaker Well-Known Member

    There's only a small handful of modern comic book films that blew me away and or that I thoroughly enjoyed. Dark Knight, Constantine, Hellboy, Road To Perdition, Ghost World, Watchmen and the first Blade come to mind.
  2. goldenstate5 Active Member

    Oh yea hahaha. And then he "ate crow".

    Jim's reversal of sorts is hysterical. In the article, it's positive, and then his follow up comment has such a bizarre negative spin, almost as if he's appealing to that idiot "stockholder" that keeps trolling. Although if it's really true that the head of marketing got canned... wow. "Yeah you did your job but you didn't have someone go around and vandalize posters for Arthur Christmas and Hugo, so you're fired!"

    That fact alone sort of makes me a little queasy. Disney did put out a press release stating that they were pleased with its modest performance... but really? The box office slump, the overabundance of family films... this does nothing to soothe the somewhat tepidness of the performance to execs? Egads, the highest opener this week made 13.5 million and is considered a major flop!

    I really hope Muppets does awesome overseas and on DVD. I still believe that we'll get something television related.
  3. zoebell Active Member

    is that really true though? the head of marketing got canned because of the film's performance? that can't be true- they couldn't have done any more press

    and the movie is a SUCCESS. it's going to make at least 80 million, got stellar reviews, will likely get golden globe and oscar noms (which will help it, that's always a good thing to put in the ads), and hasn't even opened overseas yet.

    there's no way you can call it unsuccessful. a movie failing to overperform isn't a good reason to fire somebody
  4. beaker Well-Known Member

    Unless people were expecting Titanic/Toy Story 3/Avatar performance, Muppets 2k11 is a hit. Expect the true muppety renaissance next year(in time for the end of the world!)
  5. zoebell Active Member

    i think so too. i want more than anything for them to get some kind of weekly base for which to build new fans from. that's what would really do it imo, a show that people can tune in to.
  6. Drtooth Well-Known Member

    I'm kinda disappointed it's not going to get to 70 mil this weekend (it's the last good weekend before the Chipmunks come out), but that's about it. All it needs is about 1 million more, and it's the third highest grossing Muppet movie. It's on the doorstep of fourth as it is (just a few ten thousands off) Still... 3 kid's films stealing it's BO potential, but still out performing it is something to be proud of.

    I WOULD fire the head of marketing if only for the fact the commercials for the film didn't really take off until a week before its release.
  7. brkndwnbus Active Member

    After reading about crowd drop offs, I was thinking my third viewing yesterday would be with only a few fellow moviegoers, but my 1:30 showing was packed. It was mostly families with little kids, too. I would say just about every row was almost filled to capacity except the first row.
  8. Reevz1977 Well-Known Member

    I'm kinda torn on the whole marketing of this movie. It's a well know fact I have hated all the promotion material I have seen. I think the company behind these did an abysmal job and it certainly didn't help the movie. That said, the exposure of the Muppets was FANTASTIC! They have been everywhere and awareness for the film could not, in my opinion, have been higher!

    I genuinely don't see the box office performance of "The Muppets" as poor. It's more a statement about the state of the economy. I have lost count of the number of fairly high profile movies, that would have been huge successes several year ago, disappear without a trace. I think DrTooth said it best when he said that the true test will be the home video market. I also think the international box office may throw in some pleasant surprises!

    I am now excited about the future of the Muppets. Disney just has to maintain the standard they have now set!
    frogboy4 likes this.
  9. Drtooth Well-Known Member

    The unfortunate thing is that it's a slow couple weeks since Thanksgiving weekend and we're high into shopping time now, with less time to see movies. It was going to make the bulk of its BO on Thanksgiving weekend, and maybe 20 mil the second week, 12 mill the third... If we can get at least 2 mil more by Monday, we'll have at least beat MTI as far as domestic BO goes. Still, it is a modest success that will only blow up overseas and on the DVD market. Everything now is profit. And like we said, it's no help that we have 3 other kiddy films and one more next week. It will definitely be around Christmas vacation, and hopefully it gets a bump in that period... but it is NO way a flop. A flop would imply not making back its budget. Still, why are the Muppet Movie commercials disappearing, but I saw Artless Crapfest ads like every other show.
  10. BobThePizzaBoy Well-Known Member

    Just read through the comments on Jim Hill's article, aside from one specific recurring comment, I couldn't help but chuckle at the silliness some of these people are blabbering about.

    The one recurring comment I noticed is that teenagers want nothing to do with this movie. Based on what I've seen, that's unfortunately correct. With a big movie musical like this coming out, I notice every kid at my old high school puts every musical on a pedestal and unfairly compares it to Little Shop of Horrors and Grease (I'm 95% sure that if John Travolta played Gary this movie or Audrey II made a cameo would be doing double the business it has been for this very reason). And unless it's SpongeBob SquarePants, Pokemon or maybe Pixar on a good day, they will have nothing to do with anything animated. While it's not animation, it's easy to just classify The Muppets as being animated. So it's no wonder teenagers are so narrow-minded to avoid this movie.
  11. Drtooth Well-Known Member

    Yes, but Teenagers are NOT the movie's demographic. Those teens went to (or were dragged to) see Twilight. That's like wondering why 5 year olds aren't buying enough adult sized Hong Kong Phooey T-shirts.

    Remember, FAMILY movie usually means kids under the age of 12, and their parents. It was the three other family movies that was the competition, all with the same demographic. And consider the Muppet Disney store toys are in demand (#3 best Holiday sellers, after Princess and Cars merchandise... and above OTHER Princess and Cars merchandise) while TRU's Arthur Christmas and even Happy Feet Two merchandise looks completely pristine and untouched when crowded TRU stores look like a hurricane went through it everywhere else. THOSE are the flops, and I'm sure they'll both get sequels anyway.
  12. robodog Active Member

    Arthur Christmas may be a flop but for some reason they're still plugging the heck out of the darn thing every commercial break around here. The textbook definition of beating a dead horse.
    I must have been a wierd teenager. I still watched Muppet movies back then. I don't think I ever stopped watching things like that.
  13. goldenstate5 Active Member

    To be fair, it's a classic marketing technique. Since the Muppets is an established brand, they basically tiered it:

    1) Establishment (thanks Jim Henson!)
    2) Re-introduction (thanks YouTube!)
    3) Summer teasers in front of wide release (Check! And clever, too!)
    4) Actual trailer in front of wide release (Check!)
    5) Internet promotion (more parody trailers)
    6) MASSIVE Muppet appearances on TV (checkity check!)
    7) Poster onslaught a month prior (if you live in LA like I do, that is an easy CHECK!)
    8) Commercial onslaught a week and a half prior (yup!)

    It's hard to imagine, but this has worked for Disney before. It helps establish your brand, not overwater the customer's appeal and of course get 'em while it's hot. This is, unfortunately, why most movies are so frontloaded nowadays, too. But from what I've heard, Disney is up there with Fox as having the best marketing teams in the biz.
    Duke Remington likes this.
  14. DannyRWW Well-Known Member

    Interesting comment on Toys R Us too...they are all sold out of the few Muppet items (puppets and what nots) they had even though they were a tad more costly than most toys.
  15. beaker Well-Known Member

    A new article on MSNBC notes that this is the most abysmal week/weekend for ticket sales for this time of year in some time. Yes, Muppets dropped to 4th and only took in a few million. But across the board it's just bad timing. Could this film have done better had it been released earlier? Im not sure. I think anyone who wanted to see it has seen it. The Muppets is not a truly mainstream thing. Sure, many people might have their "favorite" muppet(usually one of the main 5) BUT...to invest 10 bucks and 2 hours of their time? Im not saying the Muppets is on par with Serenity or Hitchhikers Guide, but its a heck of a lot more niche than Chipmunks. Chipmunks will probably clean house.

    But the reality of the Muppets BO kind of syncs with the story in the film
  16. zoebell Active Member

    no, because that would imply that it's a failure, which is not true. it's going to end with at least 80 million, and some awards nominations for songs, i'm sure. not to mention it has not been released overseas yet

    the reality of it being "niche" just means that the muppets don't mean anything to little kids. parents have not done a good job introducing their own kids to the muppets, and the reason this is happening like this is because the majority of the audience was adults. adults don't repeat at family films. family films, like it or not, actually do need KIDS to repeat- that's their demo.

    i mean, let's remember here- kids and families WERE the majority of the audience in 1979 for the muppet movie, which made over 200 million in today's amount. back then, it was the smash success it was because kids knew and loved the muppets already, and WANTED to see them in a movie. today's kids under 13 don't know and love them, and would have only seen this movie if a parent wanted to see it and took the kids with them. if that doesn't happen, that kid likely prefers chipmunks or twilight and just isn't interested in something they have no connection to

    i worry about the success of things like the smurfs and chipmunks, frankly. it says some not very encouraging things about the attention span and intelligence of today's kids, to be honest. they're getting some really garbage stuff thrown at them and absorbing it beyond belief.

    and this is why they need to get back on tv. if they can have a base from which to build up new fans, and kids, that's where it can happen for them. this nostalgia thing isn't gonna do it for new generations
  17. goldenstate5 Active Member

    Just FYI: The Smurfs was in 3D, which Muppets was not. If it wasn't, it would have made only a tad more than the Muppets will in its run.

    Also, this week's BO was actually good news believe it or not. The hold was pretty decent, though of course next week is the biggest tell. What it does say is that Muppets should wind up closer to 90 mil than 80. 100, unfortunately, is still off the table. I wouldn't count the film out at all. It's not a failure, it's what the industry calls: a modest success. It made its production budget back, had a good opening weekend, will do decent internationally and proved it still has some relevance. Anyone who declares this the death of the franchise is out of their mind.

    However: don't expect a theatrical film anytime soon. Now Disney will solely focus on the small screen, great DVD sales will only speed that process up. Fingers crossed for a new Muppet series!
  18. zoebell Active Member

    i think international sales will be interesting to watch. worldwide grosses sometimes tell a different story, isn't the smurfs the one that had HUGE overseas numbers that completely dwarfed it here? maybe the nostalgia factor overseas will be less niche than it apparently is here.

    if it is, then i would go further than calling it a "modest" success, i think it's just a success overall.

    i think it's definitely enough to relaunch some kind of series, by the way. nowadays, a successful tv audience doesn't have to be 30 million viewers, shows stay on the air with 5 million or less if it's a cable channel. this is a new tv media age than it was in the 70s, this "niche" muppet audience could possibly turn in some impressive tv numbers. they ought to try it- would it be that expensive to produce a new muppet show, do you think?
  19. goldenstate5 Active Member

    Well, I don't want to be audacious about the international box office since we won't know the full story for another three months. Who knows? I'm hoping for the best but so far I'm just unsure.

    As for a TV series and how expensive it would be, that largely depends. A single camera would be costly, as every set built has to be raised for the puppets, a multi-cam considerably less so. (The Muppet Show was multi-cam) Costs were a factor in the demise of the incredibly underrated "Greg the Bunny" which was single-cam. Short of reviving The Muppet Show, which interestingly enough would be considered a long overdue British import... I have no idea what they could pull off. I know that it most likely would not be on the major networks, who really don't have a desire to pull in family audiences. We're looking at cable, specifically ABC Family. The CW's ratings of Letters to Santa proves the franchise is still viable on television, and I think it would work. I'd just love to see... well, how!
  20. zoebell Active Member

    well, but given that the fanbase (as we just found out), is actually mostly adults now, who's to say that the exact demo that networks want (18-34) wouldn't be the ones tuning in? i'd say there's a pretty good chance for that, actually. i think maybe abc or fox would be a pretty good place.

    but i wouldn't mind cable. what about comedy central? i think that'd be a PERFECT fit. i bet you the audiences for a lot of the stuff on comedy central is exactly the same people who love the muppets (i remember the studio audience going wild when jon stewart made a muppet reference once on the daily show)

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